5 ms·

I agree, but 10s of hours of effort isn't anywhere near "more than I can imagine" as the OP said. I don't think anyone here is claiming it's easy

dijksterhuis 6y ago
+ 10 years crafting a unique sound.
- eslaught 6y ago
  It probably took me about 10 years to get good at programming. Sure, I could create programs pretty quickly---but making something like [1] is another matter altogether. [1]: http://regent-lang.org/ http://regent-lang.org/
  - dijksterhuis 6y ago
    But I'm guessing you were paid for programming during those 10 years.
    - eslaught 6y ago
      I guess it depends on how you count, but not really, at least not for the first 6 years or so. The first two-ish were high school, the next four were college, and the next six were in graduate school (so on a grad student's salary). After that I got a "real" job. For what it's worth, I do other artistic pursuits as well. I did music for about 15 years though I wouldn't say I was ever good. I've been writing for about 10 years. I would say I'm just now barely at the point where I think I can write half-way decently. To be clear, I am very aware, and very grateful that one of the things I happen to like doing also pays well. I was responding more to the "you can't imagine the level of effort required to do this work" aspect of the ancestors' comments. Yes, I can imagine, thank you very much. While I don't like where we're going with funding models for art, that doesn't mean that understanding the effort is the limiting factor.
    - icebraining 6y ago
      You think most developers learn programming from scratch at a job?
      - dijksterhuis 6y ago
        Key word: > during I've been paid far more for software than I have for music in the last 10+ years. Spent about equal time/effort on each. ROI is better with software (I can afford more synths and records).
        icebraining 6y ago
        I don't think anyone is disputing that ROI is better with software. That said, programming for 10 years before getting a job in the are is not uncommon. Most of my peers did it for at least five (I learned 15 years before, but I grant that's not that common).
- badfrog 6y ago
  Tons of amazing music with totally new sounds comes from people 16-20 years old. For the right person, it doesn't take a decade.
  - dijksterhuis 6y ago
    So these people just woke up one day and knew exactly how to make music?
  - tomc1985 6y ago
    And I bet they started at 10 or 12. I know I did. Also, "tons" is amazingly overstated. Very few of those 16 year olds are producing "good" music that appeals beyond their immediate demographic, and that's to say nothing of how low of standards many youth demographics have.
puranjay 6y ago
Again, it all depends on what kind of music you're trying to make. If you're copying an existing style, it's not particularly hard. I can make a Drake-like beat in an afternoon - a quick search on Splice will even show me the exact drum sounds to use. But if you're creating your own sound? That takes effort and experimentation. Creating a song - easy. Creating music that's distinctively your own - tons and tons of effort.

dijksterhuis 6y ago

+ 10 years crafting a unique sound.

eslaught 6y ago
It probably took me about 10 years to get good at programming. Sure, I could create programs pretty quickly---but making something like [1] is another matter altogether. [1]: http://regent-lang.org/ http://regent-lang.org/
- dijksterhuis 6y ago
  But I'm guessing you were paid for programming during those 10 years.
  - eslaught 6y ago
    I guess it depends on how you count, but not really, at least not for the first 6 years or so. The first two-ish were high school, the next four were college, and the next six were in graduate school (so on a grad student's salary). After that I got a "real" job. For what it's worth, I do other artistic pursuits as well. I did music for about 15 years though I wouldn't say I was ever good. I've been writing for about 10 years. I would say I'm just now barely at the point where I think I can write half-way decently. To be clear, I am very aware, and very grateful that one of the things I happen to like doing also pays well. I was responding more to the "you can't imagine the level of effort required to do this work" aspect of the ancestors' comments. Yes, I can imagine, thank you very much. While I don't like where we're going with funding models for art, that doesn't mean that understanding the effort is the limiting factor.
  - icebraining 6y ago
    You think most developers learn programming from scratch at a job?
    - dijksterhuis 6y ago
      Key word: > during I've been paid far more for software than I have for music in the last 10+ years. Spent about equal time/effort on each. ROI is better with software (I can afford more synths and records).
      - icebraining 6y ago
        I don't think anyone is disputing that ROI is better with software. That said, programming for 10 years before getting a job in the are is not uncommon. Most of my peers did it for at least five (I learned 15 years before, but I grant that's not that common).
badfrog 6y ago
Tons of amazing music with totally new sounds comes from people 16-20 years old. For the right person, it doesn't take a decade.
- dijksterhuis 6y ago
  So these people just woke up one day and knew exactly how to make music?
- tomc1985 6y ago
  And I bet they started at 10 or 12. I know I did. Also, "tons" is amazingly overstated. Very few of those 16 year olds are producing "good" music that appeals beyond their immediate demographic, and that's to say nothing of how low of standards many youth demographics have.

puranjay 6y ago

Again, it all depends on what kind of music you're trying to make. If you're copying an existing style, it's not particularly hard. I can make a Drake-like beat in an afternoon - a quick search on Splice will even show me the exact drum sounds to use. But if you're creating your own sound? That takes effort and experimentation. Creating a song - easy. Creating music that's distinctively your own - tons and tons of effort.