5 ms·

As someone who uses an advantage kinesis & dvorak, laptops & dvorak, and other people's computers & qwerty: You get used to switching back and forth in ~2 week

As someone who uses an advantage kinesis & dvorak, laptops & dvorak, and other people's computers & qwerty: You get used to switching back and forth in ~2 weeks. If you spend all your day typing, definitely spend the $ and the time to learn to type on an ergonomic keyboard with good quality switches. I think the kinesis or maltron have the best research on their ergonomics & build quality. I highly recommend them.

phaus 6y ago
The Kinesis is based on sound research. The Maltrons have a lot of keys positioned in ways that add nothing to ergonomics. Maltron also makes the claim that you can type 80 wpm with their 1 handed keyboard but there seems to be no publicly available evidence of anyone getting anywhere near that fast. I agree its pretty easy to switch back and forth between different split keyboards and to traditional keyboards. I use an Ergodox-EZ and a Dactyl Manuform on a daily basis for 2 different systems.
- StavrosK 6y ago
  I use an Ergodox-like keyboard (Centromere v2) and am currently typing on my laptop (normal Dell keyboard). I switch between the two completely effortlessly, without thinking about it. I can no longer type on my old Das, though, as I haven't used it ever since I got the Centromere. I would not get a wireless keyboard now, it's not very unreliable, but enough to be a slight nuisance for no benefit.
- alxlu 6y ago
  I tried to use one for months before giving up because I felt it was too big. I mostly enjoyed typing in the key wells, but I ended up getting thumb pain because of how much I had to stretch my hand in order to reach the enter/backspace/modifier keys.
  - phaus 6y ago
    What do you use now? The Dactyl was partly modeled after the Kinesis. It has the key wells and a curved thumb cluster. Still, the thumb cluster isn't perfect and its hard for most people to reach all of the keys. However, the Dactyl Manuform keeps the amazing key wells and has a completely redesigned thumb cluster. Its also designed to be easily customizable. There are versions with 2,3,4,5 and 6 keys per thumb cluster. Unlike the original Dactyl, the Ergodox, and the Kinesis, I have no problems at all using all 6 keys per thumb cluster on the Dactyl Manuform. IMO its the best split keyboard unless you want to go for something smaller and use layers to gain access to more keys. Unfortunately if you can't 3d print the case yourself and hand-wire it, its pretty expensive to acquire one. I just built mine recently and it almost instantly replaced my Ergodox-EZ as my favorite keyboard.
    - alxlu 6y ago
      I ended up going with the Logitech ergonomic keyboard. It’s honestly not that different than a regular keyboard but it does the job. Thanks for letting me know about dactyl though! For some reason that one flew under my radar. I guess I kinda gave up spending time looking for a perfect solution after I decided the Kinesis wasn’t working for me, but it looks like something that might work for me.
      - phaus 6y ago
        I realized I might have worded the above in a confusing way. You may have already understood in spite of that just in case there are 2 primary families of Dactyl keyboards, the Dactyl, and the Dactyl Manuform. The Manuform version has the better thumb cluster IMO.
    - tharne 6y ago
      The Dactyl is a beautiful piece of design and engineering, I've been thinking about getting one. What variation of Dactyl Manuform are you using, i.e. 4x6, 5x6?
      - phaus 6y ago
        I'm using the 5x6 layout. For me it seems like the fewest amount of keys (64) I can drop to without having to use layers. I pretty much only use layers for the function keys.
kingnothing 6y ago
I love my Kinesis Advantage, but there's definitely a learning curve that new users should expect.
Fellshard 6y ago
Exactly this. If you have distinct work and personal computers and setups, use different keyboards and layouts for each. The learning curve takes a couple months for good proficiency, but the ability to manually switch modes at a moment's notice is an enormous boon that saves you from having to reconfigure everyone else's keyboards just to type, or making continual mistakes when doing so.
- tom_ 6y ago
  Yes, I can switch between layouts, and I don't mind doing it when it's for short periods on other people's PCs. I just draw the line at having to do it for the PCs I use regularly. I use this thing for 6-8 hours a day. Comfort and familiarity is what I want, and I want it now, with no retraining required. I may be stuck in local minimum, but I'll take that risk. So I am just wondering why it's so hard to find a nice split keyboard with a standard layout. (And symmetrical meta keys.) It's not like this layout is unusual. That's what I find so odd about this!

phaus 6y ago

The Kinesis is based on sound research. The Maltrons have a lot of keys positioned in ways that add nothing to ergonomics. Maltron also makes the claim that you can type 80 wpm with their 1 handed keyboard but there seems to be no publicly available evidence of anyone getting anywhere near that fast. I agree its pretty easy to switch back and forth between different split keyboards and to traditional keyboards. I use an Ergodox-EZ and a Dactyl Manuform on a daily basis for 2 different systems.

StavrosK 6y ago
I use an Ergodox-like keyboard (Centromere v2) and am currently typing on my laptop (normal Dell keyboard). I switch between the two completely effortlessly, without thinking about it. I can no longer type on my old Das, though, as I haven't used it ever since I got the Centromere. I would not get a wireless keyboard now, it's not very unreliable, but enough to be a slight nuisance for no benefit.
alxlu 6y ago
I tried to use one for months before giving up because I felt it was too big. I mostly enjoyed typing in the key wells, but I ended up getting thumb pain because of how much I had to stretch my hand in order to reach the enter/backspace/modifier keys.
- phaus 6y ago
  What do you use now? The Dactyl was partly modeled after the Kinesis. It has the key wells and a curved thumb cluster. Still, the thumb cluster isn't perfect and its hard for most people to reach all of the keys. However, the Dactyl Manuform keeps the amazing key wells and has a completely redesigned thumb cluster. Its also designed to be easily customizable. There are versions with 2,3,4,5 and 6 keys per thumb cluster. Unlike the original Dactyl, the Ergodox, and the Kinesis, I have no problems at all using all 6 keys per thumb cluster on the Dactyl Manuform. IMO its the best split keyboard unless you want to go for something smaller and use layers to gain access to more keys. Unfortunately if you can't 3d print the case yourself and hand-wire it, its pretty expensive to acquire one. I just built mine recently and it almost instantly replaced my Ergodox-EZ as my favorite keyboard.
  - alxlu 6y ago
    I ended up going with the Logitech ergonomic keyboard. It’s honestly not that different than a regular keyboard but it does the job. Thanks for letting me know about dactyl though! For some reason that one flew under my radar. I guess I kinda gave up spending time looking for a perfect solution after I decided the Kinesis wasn’t working for me, but it looks like something that might work for me.
    - phaus 6y ago
      I realized I might have worded the above in a confusing way. You may have already understood in spite of that just in case there are 2 primary families of Dactyl keyboards, the Dactyl, and the Dactyl Manuform. The Manuform version has the better thumb cluster IMO.
  - tharne 6y ago
    The Dactyl is a beautiful piece of design and engineering, I've been thinking about getting one. What variation of Dactyl Manuform are you using, i.e. 4x6, 5x6?
    - phaus 6y ago
      I'm using the 5x6 layout. For me it seems like the fewest amount of keys (64) I can drop to without having to use layers. I pretty much only use layers for the function keys.

kingnothing 6y ago

I love my Kinesis Advantage, but there's definitely a learning curve that new users should expect.

Fellshard 6y ago

Exactly this. If you have distinct work and personal computers and setups, use different keyboards and layouts for each. The learning curve takes a couple months for good proficiency, but the ability to manually switch modes at a moment's notice is an enormous boon that saves you from having to reconfigure everyone else's keyboards just to type, or making continual mistakes when doing so.

tom_ 6y ago
Yes, I can switch between layouts, and I don't mind doing it when it's for short periods on other people's PCs. I just draw the line at having to do it for the PCs I use regularly. I use this thing for 6-8 hours a day. Comfort and familiarity is what I want, and I want it now, with no retraining required. I may be stuck in local minimum, but I'll take that risk. So I am just wondering why it's so hard to find a nice split keyboard with a standard layout. (And symmetrical meta keys.) It's not like this layout is unusual. That's what I find so odd about this!