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This is pretty cool. I was thinking about ordering and building a dactyl manuform [1] after my latest upgrade, the kyria [2] which improved the inflammation in

This is pretty cool. I was thinking about ordering and building a dactyl manuform [1] after my latest upgrade, the kyria [2] which improved the inflammation in my index fingers, failed to truly solve my issues because they put my thumbs in a very contorted position. I love how you can rotate the thumb keys as its unnatural to have your thumbs press keys in the same direction as the rest of your fingers. Having started with very generic ergonomic keyboards, and now progressing to hand built keyboards have taught me that if you are experiencing some sort of tendon, nerve, or joint issues from standard keyboard use, you really need to dive into the deep end and get the most ergonomic thing out there even if $300 for a keyboard, when you can buy one for under $20, sounds incredibly expensive. If you don't, you'll likely end up paying that much to just keep fixing or improving the situation. And if you don't try to fix the situation you'll pay for it in damage to your hands which to me has no monetary value* . I might still choose to build the manuform, but it's nice that there's an option out there with adjustable thumb keys, I've never seen that before and I hope it becomes a trend in the split ergonomic keyboard world. [1] https://tomoakley.me/article/2020/01/1-month-with-the-dactyl-manuform https://tomoakley.me/article/2020/01/1-month-with-the-dactyl... [2] https://blog.splitkb.com/blog/introducing-the-kyria https://blog.splitkb.com/blog/introducing-the-kyria * okay, maybe there is an exact amount in terms of how much money you can no longer make through typing ability that is lost, but my point is there is an intrinsic value to having fully functional hands.

clavalle 6y ago
The Kyria...that looks like a lot of thought went into it. And I like that you can download templates so you can print them out and find the right size.
- RedBeetDeadpool 6y ago
  I love my kyria, The number of keyboards the author went through before making this design in my opinion highlight all the issues he solved.
wdgz 6y ago
I just got a $1900 bill from my last appointment with my Hand Doctor at UCSF. So the ~200 I spent on my custom Dactyl that has actually taken my pain from a level ~4 to near 0 is really a drop in the bucket for my health. (+1 for the DM! I have the normal Dactyl because a thumb injury makes the cluster unusable for me, but I have plenty of friends who love the DM.)
johnm 6y ago
Can you add more details about the problems you had with the Kyria thumb positioning? Too much usage of the inward thumb keys? Angles?
- RedBeetDeadpool 6y ago
  Its the angle of the thumb keys, which is the restriction of printing all the keys for one hand on one board. I like the keyboard linked here because the thumb keys are at a different angle. I really like the kyria though because of the aggressive staggering. It resolved a lot of issues I got because my middle finger is so much longer than my index finger. But in order to take advantage of the stagger, I have to keep my wrists at the same angle of the plate, and if I keep my wrists at that same angle then my thumbs have to hit the keys with their side and tuck to the side of my palm like a trex because there's not as much space between the thumb and the keys. The ideal angle that the thumb bends is roughly perpendicular to the angle the rest of your fingers bend. The thumb cluster though is a fantastic improvement over pinky modifiers, that's not my complaint.
  - johnm 6y ago
    I see. Yeah, sounds like a one of the Dactyl Manuform's is in your future. :-) Given the parametric nature, it seems like you be able to tune it to your specifics. For me, on the existing flat thumb ergos, hitting the thumb buttons with the side of the thumb actually feels normal to me in terms of thumb & wrist motion. The primary issue is the angles and arc of the splaying of the thumb to hit the keys without having to contort my thumbs any. This is my biggest issue with the Kinesis Advantage and ErgoDox. The second biggest factor is that the tall Cherry style switches and keycaps requires a lot of travel distance for activation. One the more recent ergo boards, I've switched to lower profile switches and that makes a non-trivial improvement as well. My upcoming build is with the choc minis + low profile keycaps but with heavier springs so they feel more like the last generation of the 17" MBP keyboard (as opposed the crap that's Apple's done with their recent keys).
nico_h 6y ago
There is this person selling assembled to order Dactyl manuforms: https://dactyl.bigcartel.com/ https://dactyl.bigcartel.com/

clavalle 6y ago

The Kyria...that looks like a lot of thought went into it. And I like that you can download templates so you can print them out and find the right size.

RedBeetDeadpool 6y ago
I love my kyria, The number of keyboards the author went through before making this design in my opinion highlight all the issues he solved.

wdgz 6y ago

I just got a $1900 bill from my last appointment with my Hand Doctor at UCSF. So the ~200 I spent on my custom Dactyl that has actually taken my pain from a level ~4 to near 0 is really a drop in the bucket for my health. (+1 for the DM! I have the normal Dactyl because a thumb injury makes the cluster unusable for me, but I have plenty of friends who love the DM.)

johnm 6y ago

Can you add more details about the problems you had with the Kyria thumb positioning? Too much usage of the inward thumb keys? Angles?

RedBeetDeadpool 6y ago
Its the angle of the thumb keys, which is the restriction of printing all the keys for one hand on one board. I like the keyboard linked here because the thumb keys are at a different angle. I really like the kyria though because of the aggressive staggering. It resolved a lot of issues I got because my middle finger is so much longer than my index finger. But in order to take advantage of the stagger, I have to keep my wrists at the same angle of the plate, and if I keep my wrists at that same angle then my thumbs have to hit the keys with their side and tuck to the side of my palm like a trex because there's not as much space between the thumb and the keys. The ideal angle that the thumb bends is roughly perpendicular to the angle the rest of your fingers bend. The thumb cluster though is a fantastic improvement over pinky modifiers, that's not my complaint.
- johnm 6y ago
  I see. Yeah, sounds like a one of the Dactyl Manuform's is in your future. :-) Given the parametric nature, it seems like you be able to tune it to your specifics. For me, on the existing flat thumb ergos, hitting the thumb buttons with the side of the thumb actually feels normal to me in terms of thumb & wrist motion. The primary issue is the angles and arc of the splaying of the thumb to hit the keys without having to contort my thumbs any. This is my biggest issue with the Kinesis Advantage and ErgoDox. The second biggest factor is that the tall Cherry style switches and keycaps requires a lot of travel distance for activation. One the more recent ergo boards, I've switched to lower profile switches and that makes a non-trivial improvement as well. My upcoming build is with the choc minis + low profile keycaps but with heavier springs so they feel more like the last generation of the 17" MBP keyboard (as opposed the crap that's Apple's done with their recent keys).

nico_h 6y ago

There is this person selling assembled to order Dactyl manuforms: https://dactyl.bigcartel.com/ https://dactyl.bigcartel.com/