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Yeah, this situation seems quite worrying. It was already worrying with only two x86 companies (VIA is leagues behind). It would also be nice to have some capa

Yeah, this situation seems quite worrying. It was already worrying with only two x86 companies (VIA is leagues behind). It would also be nice to have some capable foundries in Europe, like STM or Infineon. Just in case.

NicoJuicy 6y ago
ASML?
- ragebol 6y ago
  ASML is not a foundry. ASML makes (part of) the machines that make up a foundry.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - jp555 6y ago
    just "machines", or a key EUV machine that only ASML makes?
    - Keyframe 6y ago
      Also, Intel owns like 15% of ASML.
      - tooltalk 6y ago
        Well, not quite. All foundry players, eg, TSMC, Intel, and Samsung invested heavily in ASML in effort to jumpstart EUV development. They significantly reduced their financial stakes to a low single digit since as the tech matured. https://www.eetimes.com/intel-again-cuts-stake-in-asml/# https://www.eetimes.com/intel-again-cuts-stake-in-asml/#
bitL 6y ago
Was Dresden GF foundry shut down?
- gsnedders 6y ago
  No, it's still going. Not sure they're producing anything below 22nm, though, and purely low-power (FDSOI) parts. There's also TI's site in Freising which is a notable fab producing analogue parts.
paulmd 6y ago
If there is one company with the will, the liquid cash, and the volume to break away from TSMC, it is Apple. Just saying. They design their own chips in-house, they are moving to use them across their full stack, they are already TSMC's #1 customer by a wide margin, and they could literally build a 3nm fab with 40k wafers per month with less than 10% of the liquid cash they have on hand ($5b for the node and $15b for the fab). And they are the type of company who brings everything possible in-house, and the type of company who looks at a single-source monopoly like TSMC as a business risk. Fabs are literally the last part of their hardware/software stack that they don't control and that another company could potentially leverage them over. Right now there is no alternative to TSMC, people literally pre-eulogize NVIDIA Ampere and other products simply because they're on Samsung instead of TSMC. How do you think that looks to a company like Apple, that they are completely dependent on this company for node tech and subject to increasing competition for wafers as everybody else realizes there is no alternative and piles in too? https://www.extremetech.com/computing/272096-3nm-process-node https://www.extremetech.com/computing/272096-3nm-process-nod...

NicoJuicy 6y ago

ASML?

ragebol 6y ago
ASML is not a foundry. ASML makes (part of) the machines that make up a foundry.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- jp555 6y ago
  just "machines", or a key EUV machine that only ASML makes?
  - Keyframe 6y ago
    Also, Intel owns like 15% of ASML.
    - tooltalk 6y ago
      Well, not quite. All foundry players, eg, TSMC, Intel, and Samsung invested heavily in ASML in effort to jumpstart EUV development. They significantly reduced their financial stakes to a low single digit since as the tech matured. https://www.eetimes.com/intel-again-cuts-stake-in-asml/# https://www.eetimes.com/intel-again-cuts-stake-in-asml/#

bitL 6y ago

Was Dresden GF foundry shut down?

gsnedders 6y ago
No, it's still going. Not sure they're producing anything below 22nm, though, and purely low-power (FDSOI) parts. There's also TI's site in Freising which is a notable fab producing analogue parts.

paulmd 6y ago

If there is one company with the will, the liquid cash, and the volume to break away from TSMC, it is Apple. Just saying. They design their own chips in-house, they are moving to use them across their full stack, they are already TSMC's #1 customer by a wide margin, and they could literally build a 3nm fab with 40k wafers per month with less than 10% of the liquid cash they have on hand ($5b for the node and $15b for the fab). And they are the type of company who brings everything possible in-house, and the type of company who looks at a single-source monopoly like TSMC as a business risk. Fabs are literally the last part of their hardware/software stack that they don't control and that another company could potentially leverage them over. Right now there is no alternative to TSMC, people literally pre-eulogize NVIDIA Ampere and other products simply because they're on Samsung instead of TSMC. How do you think that looks to a company like Apple, that they are completely dependent on this company for node tech and subject to increasing competition for wafers as everybody else realizes there is no alternative and piles in too? https://www.extremetech.com/computing/272096-3nm-process-node https://www.extremetech.com/computing/272096-3nm-process-nod...