4 ms·

Churches are one of the biggest business entities in any part of the world. Most churches are structured like a proper business entity (Eg. they have equivalent

by neya 6y ago

Churches are one of the biggest business entities in any part of the world. Most churches are structured like a proper business entity (Eg. they have equivalent of directors, CEOs and managers) and have revenue targets and KPIs set. Most churches are also located in some of the prime real estate of top tier cities and I always wondered how they were able to afford paying $1500+/Sq.M in a prime, central area. About the charity work - I know for a fact the charity work the churches do cost less than 10% of the income they make, I got this number from a former church member who was a top level guy in his church. Given that churches are anyway structured like a business entity internally and manage money like a proper business, why shouldn't they be taxed as one? It makes no sense to not tax them no matter how you try to justify it. If they did get an exemption, so should Mc Donald's for giving away a free Cola bottle with every $20 meal you get.

HPsquared 6y ago
Well... The government has managers, KPIs, prime real estate etc as well - is it a business too?
- BookHeretykow 6y ago
  Actually yes. Why government should have prime real estate? Why government officials should not pay taxes? Because it's government? Honestly, this is just a job. This is just a building that serve some purpose. This is kinda business which provides you something in exchange of mandatory subscription ️
simonh 6y ago
So churches should be taxed because they use effective organisational structures and are well run? That’s a new one. You could say the same of well run charities.
- neya 6y ago
  You know the point I'm making - It's a business entity because it makes money and manages money like any other business. Why shouldn't it be taxed?
  - wcarey 6y ago
    There are an enormous number of (small) churches that don't function as business entities in the way you describe. Taxing churches would adversely select against these, encouraging all churches to behave more like businesses. It's unlikely to me that that's the outcome that anyone wants. If you think Christianity is broadly good and correct, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors is deeply corrosive to the faith. If you think Christianity is broadly bad and corrupt, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors entrenches and effectively promulgates many of the religious ideas that you abhor.
- henriquemaia 6y ago
  I'm not OP. And yes, at first sight that seems to be the main argument. But... If we're fair to what it is being said, the point seems to be this: churches are like corporations: their goal is to grow in size and revenue. That is demonstrated by the anecdata of a friend, someone high enough in a particular church, that confirms they only spent 10% of their income on charity. So the gist seems to be this: if it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like duck, it must be taxed like a duck. Not a bad argument per se. However, it lacks supporting data, preaching for those who already feel that religious institutions are a scam anyway. So, because of that, it's not very persuasive.
koheripbal 6y ago
> I know for a fact the charity work the churches do cost less than 10% of the income they make If you really know this for a FACT, then I'm sure you can share your source for this information. Churches are currently treated almost exactly like any other non-profit by the IRS. Taxing them specifically, but NOT other non-profits means we would be specifically discriminating against a religious organization. ...and religious persecution is a new level of left-wing intolerance that I, sadly, would not be surprised to see.
chadash 6y ago
Most churches are located on expensive real estate? And most are run like big businesses? And you know for a fact that charity work is less than 10% of income? These are bold statements that need sources other than some guy you know.

by neya 6y ago

HPsquared 6y ago

Well... The government has managers, KPIs, prime real estate etc as well - is it a business too?

BookHeretykow 6y ago
Actually yes. Why government should have prime real estate? Why government officials should not pay taxes? Because it's government? Honestly, this is just a job. This is just a building that serve some purpose. This is kinda business which provides you something in exchange of mandatory subscription ️

simonh 6y ago

So churches should be taxed because they use effective organisational structures and are well run? That’s a new one. You could say the same of well run charities.

neya 6y ago
You know the point I'm making - It's a business entity because it makes money and manages money like any other business. Why shouldn't it be taxed?
- wcarey 6y ago
  There are an enormous number of (small) churches that don't function as business entities in the way you describe. Taxing churches would adversely select against these, encouraging all churches to behave more like businesses. It's unlikely to me that that's the outcome that anyone wants. If you think Christianity is broadly good and correct, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors is deeply corrosive to the faith. If you think Christianity is broadly bad and corrupt, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors entrenches and effectively promulgates many of the religious ideas that you abhor.
henriquemaia 6y ago
I'm not OP. And yes, at first sight that seems to be the main argument. But... If we're fair to what it is being said, the point seems to be this: churches are like corporations: their goal is to grow in size and revenue. That is demonstrated by the anecdata of a friend, someone high enough in a particular church, that confirms they only spent 10% of their income on charity. So the gist seems to be this: if it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like duck, it must be taxed like a duck. Not a bad argument per se. However, it lacks supporting data, preaching for those who already feel that religious institutions are a scam anyway. So, because of that, it's not very persuasive.

koheripbal 6y ago

> I know for a fact the charity work the churches do cost less than 10% of the income they make If you really know this for a FACT, then I'm sure you can share your source for this information. Churches are currently treated almost exactly like any other non-profit by the IRS. Taxing them specifically, but NOT other non-profits means we would be specifically discriminating against a religious organization. ...and religious persecution is a new level of left-wing intolerance that I, sadly, would not be surprised to see.

chadash 6y ago

Most churches are located on expensive real estate? And most are run like big businesses? And you know for a fact that charity work is less than 10% of income? These are bold statements that need sources other than some guy you know.