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This title is editorialized. The article confirms that this was due to a bug in iOS and is not Instagram's fault.

WilTimSon 6y ago
Interesting to see the difference in perspectives: Reddit is jumping on that quote about it being a bug and saying it's definitely intentional, while HN is taking a more conservative approach. Personally, I always err on the side of bug/incompetence rather than maliciousness in matters like this because even Facebook isn't brazen enough to pull something this obvious.
- jchonphoenix 6y ago
  I think the key here is that it's a bug in iOS, not in Instagram. So FB isn't even the responsible party. Additionally, it's a beta version of iOS, so we're supposed to be expecting bugs anyway.
  - spsful 6y ago
    Almost funny to see that people are taking a feature from an unreleased, beta version of iOS as certain proof that companies are acting mischievous.
    - JaimeThompson 6y ago
      To be fair given the Facebook family of applications history in regards to gathering information from every source possible there isn't much reason to give them the benefit of the doubt.
    - detaro 6y ago
      Even more funny (or sad?) is people reading an article with a headline saying it's Instagram, clearly quoting Instagram as saying they'll fix the bug, and then claim Apple is at fault, despite nothing in the article suggesting that.
  - IncRnd 6y ago
    Are you getting that interpretation from the article's text? The article says that Instagram found and is fixing a bug in iOS. That is incredibly doubtful, since they don't have the source code or OTA update mechanism for iOS. They found and are fixing a bug in Instagram code on iOS.
- simonbarker87 6y ago
  Don’t put down to malice that which can be explained by incompetence. It’s generally a happier way to live and view the world.
  - elmo2you 6y ago
    While that final conclusion might definitely be true, have you even considered how that exact behavior may already led us to a rather nasty reality? A reality in which many companies might regularly get away with malice by just claiming incompetence? As if that should even have any influence on their (legal) responsibilities in the first place(?) Assuming malice does happen, and I certainly think it does, at which point would you consider this approach willful ignorance? Would it not make one actually part of the problem, instead of just an observer? More to the point, when is personal happiness more important than discovering the truth? Is the latter not a personal responsibility to anyone, given a capacity?
    - simonbarker87 6y ago
      You’ve sort of blown right past the word “assume” in this expression. Assumption is what we go on when we have no proof - so, until you have proof, assume incompetence. Making this initial assumption (effectively giving the benefit of the doubt) does not mean you should stop looking for proof/under lying reasons. What it does is reduce the dopamine hit you get from being angered/outraged and let’s you think with a clearer head moving forward in your thinking/investigating. I at no point said “assume incompetence and then stick your head in the sand and pretend all is fine” that’s has its own saying “ignorance is bliss”
      - simonbarker87 6y ago
        Ah, ok - I didn’t used the word assume in my initial comment, picked it up from yours. Probably a better version would be “don’t assume malice when it can be explained by incompetence”
  - ta17711771 6y ago
    Thanks to the other commenter. No, closing your eyes and chewing through the legbone bitd of your colleague in your sausage is not the move.
- Shank 6y ago
  This is just the TikTok clipboard problem all over again. Reasonable developers who've dealt with initializing APIs that are complex or not their initial forte will make decisions like "initialize the camera on app open if we need it and then pull data from it later." It's pretty trivial to make that mistake. I wouldn't even be surprised if this is part of Instagram having a goal to make opening camera capture really fast. They've done very similar things intentionally before. [0][1] [0]: https://speakerdeck.com/mikeyk/secrets-to-lightning-fast-mobile-design?slide=71 https://speakerdeck.com/mikeyk/secrets-to-lightning-fast-mob... [1]: https://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/05/01/instagrams-secret-to-super-quick-photo-uploads-send-fast-match-data-later/ https://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/05/01/instagrams-secret-t...
saagarjha 6y ago
> The article confirms that this was due to a bug in iOS and is not Instagram's fault. Where does it do that? As far as I can tell, Instagram is calling the camera APIs when it doesn't need to and iOS is flagging that as it should.
- spsful 6y ago
  >“We only access your camera when you tell us to — for example, when you swipe from Feed to Camera. We found and are fixing a bug in iOS 14 Beta that mistakenly indicates that some people are using the camera when they aren’t,” the spokesperson said. “We do not access your camera in those instances, and no content is recorded.”
  - wnoise 6y ago
    FWIW, I read that as > We found and are fixing a bug in [the instagram app for] iOS 14 Beta
  - alluro2 6y ago
    That interpretation would indicate that they - Instagram - are fixing an iOS 14 bug, which is pretty unlikely to be the case.

Interesting to see the difference in perspectives: Reddit is jumping on that quote about it being a bug and saying it's definitely intentional, while HN is taking a more conservative approach. Personally, I always err on the side of bug/incompetence rather than maliciousness in matters like this because even Facebook isn't brazen enough to pull something this obvious.

jchonphoenix 6y ago
I think the key here is that it's a bug in iOS, not in Instagram. So FB isn't even the responsible party. Additionally, it's a beta version of iOS, so we're supposed to be expecting bugs anyway.
- spsful 6y ago
  Almost funny to see that people are taking a feature from an unreleased, beta version of iOS as certain proof that companies are acting mischievous.
  - JaimeThompson 6y ago
    To be fair given the Facebook family of applications history in regards to gathering information from every source possible there isn't much reason to give them the benefit of the doubt.
  - detaro 6y ago
    Even more funny (or sad?) is people reading an article with a headline saying it's Instagram, clearly quoting Instagram as saying they'll fix the bug, and then claim Apple is at fault, despite nothing in the article suggesting that.
- IncRnd 6y ago
  Are you getting that interpretation from the article's text? The article says that Instagram found and is fixing a bug in iOS. That is incredibly doubtful, since they don't have the source code or OTA update mechanism for iOS. They found and are fixing a bug in Instagram code on iOS.
simonbarker87 6y ago
Don’t put down to malice that which can be explained by incompetence. It’s generally a happier way to live and view the world.
- elmo2you 6y ago
  While that final conclusion might definitely be true, have you even considered how that exact behavior may already led us to a rather nasty reality? A reality in which many companies might regularly get away with malice by just claiming incompetence? As if that should even have any influence on their (legal) responsibilities in the first place(?) Assuming malice does happen, and I certainly think it does, at which point would you consider this approach willful ignorance? Would it not make one actually part of the problem, instead of just an observer? More to the point, when is personal happiness more important than discovering the truth? Is the latter not a personal responsibility to anyone, given a capacity?
  - simonbarker87 6y ago
    You’ve sort of blown right past the word “assume” in this expression. Assumption is what we go on when we have no proof - so, until you have proof, assume incompetence. Making this initial assumption (effectively giving the benefit of the doubt) does not mean you should stop looking for proof/under lying reasons. What it does is reduce the dopamine hit you get from being angered/outraged and let’s you think with a clearer head moving forward in your thinking/investigating. I at no point said “assume incompetence and then stick your head in the sand and pretend all is fine” that’s has its own saying “ignorance is bliss”
    - simonbarker87 6y ago
      Ah, ok - I didn’t used the word assume in my initial comment, picked it up from yours. Probably a better version would be “don’t assume malice when it can be explained by incompetence”
- ta17711771 6y ago
  Thanks to the other commenter. No, closing your eyes and chewing through the legbone bitd of your colleague in your sausage is not the move.
Shank 6y ago
This is just the TikTok clipboard problem all over again. Reasonable developers who've dealt with initializing APIs that are complex or not their initial forte will make decisions like "initialize the camera on app open if we need it and then pull data from it later." It's pretty trivial to make that mistake. I wouldn't even be surprised if this is part of Instagram having a goal to make opening camera capture really fast. They've done very similar things intentionally before. [0][1] [0]: https://speakerdeck.com/mikeyk/secrets-to-lightning-fast-mobile-design?slide=71 https://speakerdeck.com/mikeyk/secrets-to-lightning-fast-mob... [1]: https://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/05/01/instagrams-secret-to-super-quick-photo-uploads-send-fast-match-data-later/ https://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/05/01/instagrams-secret-t...

saagarjha 6y ago

> The article confirms that this was due to a bug in iOS and is not Instagram's fault. Where does it do that? As far as I can tell, Instagram is calling the camera APIs when it doesn't need to and iOS is flagging that as it should.

spsful 6y ago
>“We only access your camera when you tell us to — for example, when you swipe from Feed to Camera. We found and are fixing a bug in iOS 14 Beta that mistakenly indicates that some people are using the camera when they aren’t,” the spokesperson said. “We do not access your camera in those instances, and no content is recorded.”
- wnoise 6y ago
  FWIW, I read that as > We found and are fixing a bug in [the instagram app for] iOS 14 Beta
- alluro2 6y ago
  That interpretation would indicate that they - Instagram - are fixing an iOS 14 bug, which is pretty unlikely to be the case.