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What a coincidence - I was just watching this month old interview a few hours before it was posted here. Maybe Youtube's algo is pushing it... Anyway, the way

What a coincidence - I was just watching this month old interview a few hours before it was posted here. Maybe Youtube's algo is pushing it... Anyway, the way Joscha explained various concepts was very interesting - the phrases he used kept me hooked. At the very least it's entertaining. For example: "Social media is the world's brain hooked on dopamine - creating a permanent seizure" "Entropic Abyss" "Closed Cooling Chain" Interesting guy with an interesting upbringing (grew up in Eastern Germany - his site http://bach.ai http://bach.ai). It's a long interview - but here is the breakdown of topics being discussed (time stamps taken from the comments section) 0:00 - Introduction 3:14 - Reverse engineering Joscha Bach 10:38 - Nature of truth 18:47 - Original thinking 23:14 - Sentience vs intelligence 31:45 - Mind vs Reality 46:51 - Hard problem of consciousness 51:09 - Connection between the mind and the universe 56:29 - What is consciousness 1:02:32 - Language and concepts 1:09:02 - Meta-learning 1:16:35 - Spirit 1:18:10 - Our civilization may not exist for long 1:37:48 - Twitter and social media 1:44:52 - What systems of government might work well? 1:47:12 - The way out of self-destruction with AI 1:55:18 - AI simulating humans to understand its own nature 2:04:32 - Reinforcement learning 2:09:12 - Commonsense reasoning 2:15:47 - Would AGI need to have a body? 2:22:34 - Neuralink 2:27:01 - Reasoning at the scale of neurons and societies 2:37:16 - Role of emotion 2:48:03 - Happiness is a cookie that your brain bakes for itself EDIT: clarity

agigao 6y ago
Thank you!
08-15 6y ago
I noticed the same thing and had the opposite reaction. "Social media is the world's brain hooked on dopamine - creating a permanent seizure" Wow, what an insightful statement! Except it isn't. It's not even a statement. It's just different metaphors piled on top of each other until they nothing at all anymore. "Entropic Abyss" Lex Fridman actually asked for clarification here, but none came. Joscha fixed the mispronunciation, that's all. The phrase is completely meaningless. "Closed Cooling Chain" And that one is a bad translation from German "geschlossene Kuehlkette", meaning that your convenience food is frozen once at the factory and never warms up until it's in your microwave oven. It translates to "uninterrupted", not "closed". I'm pretty disappointed by the onslaught of empty phrases and the dearth of insight or arguments.
- uxcolumbo 6y ago
  That social media statement - doesn't necessarily have to be super insightful. The mental image triggered by that sentence is funny and there is some truth to it. > "Entropic Abyss" ... The phrase is completely meaningless. Well, it wasn't meaningless to the interviewer - he actually found it poetic. And for me it triggered an interesting mental image. > bad translation from German... It translates to "uninterrupted", not "closed". I just looked up the words. 'Geschlossene' comes from schliessen, which means to close. Uninterrupted in German seems to be 'ununterbrochen'. So Closed Cooling Chain actually seems to be a good translation and it nicely rolls off the tongue - CCC. > I'm pretty disappointed by the onslaught of empty phrases and the dearth of insight or arguments. I realized some might not get much out of it - hence why I said that at the very least Joscha is entertaining to listen to (subjective - I know). I got something out of it - what Joscha says makes me think - even if at the end I won't get enlightened, I look forward to check out his other work.
  - 08-15 6y ago
    > The mental image triggered by that sentence is funny and there is some truth to it. Sure, but funny isn't insightful. > I just looked up the words. Words from one language don't map perfectly to those of another; idioms map even less well. Are you seriously trying to lecture me about idioms in my native tongue, German? Which happens to be Joscha's native tongue, too, which is probably the reason why some of his phrases sound insightful to you and like bad translations to me. Another example: "A spirit is an operating system a brain runs on." Apparently he tried to translate German "Geist", which could be "spirit", "ghost", or "mind". The appropriate translation is "mind", then it makes sense. The mistranslation to "spirit" makes it sound profound, unless you take the time to think about it. But you can't, because Joscha talks so fast.
    - uxcolumbo 6y ago
      > Sure, but funny isn't insightful. Is that an established and commonly understood fact? To me anything that provides some understanding to a complicated matter or situation can be insightful - even funny things. What isn't insightful to you might be insightful to others. Don't forget not everyone is at the same level of understanding. > Closed Cooling Chain vs Uninterrupted Cooling Chain When he says 'Closed' - it implies that it's uninterrupted. Have you ever heard of the term 'Closed Circuit'? Same thing. I prefer his translation. It's simpler and sounds better (to me). > Apparently he tried to translate German "Geist", which could be "spirit", "ghost", or "mind" Interesting. Did he use 'Geist' originally in his German presentation? If he meant mind - why didn't he use the German word 'Verstand' - which seems to be a more accurate translation for mind. But you tell me, as this is your native tongue. Maybe he wants to add some colour to his talks? If so, then I think spirit is totally fine to me. It doesn't make it sound anymore profound. I would say it makes it more interesting. And maybe the other reason why he used the word spirit and not mind, might be to cater to a certain audience, e.g. the viewers for the chaos computer club videos might appreciate sci-fi like Ghost in the Shell. You wouldn't say Mind in the Shell. Sounds dry and boring (to me). But spirit has a more positive connotation vs Ghost - another reason why he might have chosen that word in the quote you mentioned. Joscha seems to have a knack for this - explaining things in a simple, interesting and entertaining way. Just look at all the comments on the various videos he appears in. You might already have a deep understanding of the topics he talks about, but not everyone has.

agigao 6y ago

Thank you!

08-15 6y ago

I noticed the same thing and had the opposite reaction. "Social media is the world's brain hooked on dopamine - creating a permanent seizure" Wow, what an insightful statement! Except it isn't. It's not even a statement. It's just different metaphors piled on top of each other until they nothing at all anymore. "Entropic Abyss" Lex Fridman actually asked for clarification here, but none came. Joscha fixed the mispronunciation, that's all. The phrase is completely meaningless. "Closed Cooling Chain" And that one is a bad translation from German "geschlossene Kuehlkette", meaning that your convenience food is frozen once at the factory and never warms up until it's in your microwave oven. It translates to "uninterrupted", not "closed". I'm pretty disappointed by the onslaught of empty phrases and the dearth of insight or arguments.

uxcolumbo 6y ago
That social media statement - doesn't necessarily have to be super insightful. The mental image triggered by that sentence is funny and there is some truth to it. > "Entropic Abyss" ... The phrase is completely meaningless. Well, it wasn't meaningless to the interviewer - he actually found it poetic. And for me it triggered an interesting mental image. > bad translation from German... It translates to "uninterrupted", not "closed". I just looked up the words. 'Geschlossene' comes from schliessen, which means to close. Uninterrupted in German seems to be 'ununterbrochen'. So Closed Cooling Chain actually seems to be a good translation and it nicely rolls off the tongue - CCC. > I'm pretty disappointed by the onslaught of empty phrases and the dearth of insight or arguments. I realized some might not get much out of it - hence why I said that at the very least Joscha is entertaining to listen to (subjective - I know). I got something out of it - what Joscha says makes me think - even if at the end I won't get enlightened, I look forward to check out his other work.
- 08-15 6y ago
  > The mental image triggered by that sentence is funny and there is some truth to it. Sure, but funny isn't insightful. > I just looked up the words. Words from one language don't map perfectly to those of another; idioms map even less well. Are you seriously trying to lecture me about idioms in my native tongue, German? Which happens to be Joscha's native tongue, too, which is probably the reason why some of his phrases sound insightful to you and like bad translations to me. Another example: "A spirit is an operating system a brain runs on." Apparently he tried to translate German "Geist", which could be "spirit", "ghost", or "mind". The appropriate translation is "mind", then it makes sense. The mistranslation to "spirit" makes it sound profound, unless you take the time to think about it. But you can't, because Joscha talks so fast.
  - uxcolumbo 6y ago
    > Sure, but funny isn't insightful. Is that an established and commonly understood fact? To me anything that provides some understanding to a complicated matter or situation can be insightful - even funny things. What isn't insightful to you might be insightful to others. Don't forget not everyone is at the same level of understanding. > Closed Cooling Chain vs Uninterrupted Cooling Chain When he says 'Closed' - it implies that it's uninterrupted. Have you ever heard of the term 'Closed Circuit'? Same thing. I prefer his translation. It's simpler and sounds better (to me). > Apparently he tried to translate German "Geist", which could be "spirit", "ghost", or "mind" Interesting. Did he use 'Geist' originally in his German presentation? If he meant mind - why didn't he use the German word 'Verstand' - which seems to be a more accurate translation for mind. But you tell me, as this is your native tongue. Maybe he wants to add some colour to his talks? If so, then I think spirit is totally fine to me. It doesn't make it sound anymore profound. I would say it makes it more interesting. And maybe the other reason why he used the word spirit and not mind, might be to cater to a certain audience, e.g. the viewers for the chaos computer club videos might appreciate sci-fi like Ghost in the Shell. You wouldn't say Mind in the Shell. Sounds dry and boring (to me). But spirit has a more positive connotation vs Ghost - another reason why he might have chosen that word in the quote you mentioned. Joscha seems to have a knack for this - explaining things in a simple, interesting and entertaining way. Just look at all the comments on the various videos he appears in. You might already have a deep understanding of the topics he talks about, but not everyone has.