4 ms·

You can say the same thing about any single lower undergraduate subject.

by p1esk 6y ago

AnimalMuppet 6y ago
I took a class in Library Science. It didn't change my outlook on anything. It only confirmed my belief in the wastefulness of certain general ed requirements. Economic history didn't do much for me, either. (Now, granted, that could be eye-opening, for at least some people, if taught well and with solid content. But in my case, for that class... meh.)
- p1esk 6y ago
  It didn't change my outlook on anything Someone can say this about any single lower undergraduate subject :) p.s. Library Science course would have been an eye-opening experience for me, given my fascination with books and libraries when I was a teenager.
  - vonseel 6y ago
    I’m not sure how fascinating it gets beyond the Dewey Decimal system, lol. There’s probably some cool stuff with document preservation and archiving. But so much of library science seems outdated now that most information is on the internet. What they really need is a better system for internet research, the UIs those systems use last time I worked in a library on a project was terrible.
- agumonkey 6y ago
  should we (could we) compress higher education ? I found a lot of redundancy by splitting things in modules. (uml, oop, sql felt like 3 sides of the same hypercoin, granted the first 2 may disappear from books soon). algorithmics and mathematics (and other topics) may be merged into one ? or maybe that would be pedagogically detrimental.. I feel that it would allow more time to spend on a concept since you don't have to see bits scattered in different courses.
  - gizmo686 6y ago
    No student learns everything that university teaches; there is simply not enough time. It would be ideal if each student received a perfectly customized curriculum; but that is simply not practical to do. Instead, universities have a modular system; where different students can mix and match modules to cover what they are interested in. Similarly, different majors can mix and match required module to cover the material that is nessasary for said majors. In the case of subjects with a very large number of students, it is possible to produce specialized modules, so you might have a university offer a separate probability-for-scientists and probability-for-mathematicians classes that it considers to be interchangable, but differs in how it covers the subject/what background it assumes.
  - tsimionescu 6y ago
    I'm not sure how oop and sql would be the same thing - they are famously incompatible (object/relational impedance mismatch). UML is just a graphical notation, I would agree it doesn't make sense as a separate course. When you say algorithmics and mathematics, do you mean all of computer science and all of maths? Do you think a single course should cover, say, Dijkstra's algorithm and partial differential equations? Usually, each course already covers a wide array of concepts. I can't think of a single concept that was explored by different bits in different courses. The closest I can think of are 2 courses I had, one of which was focused on analytical solutions for linear algebra (matrices), and the other focused on numerical solutions to the same problems. Even then, the split did make sense, since they were focused on different concepts (mathematical objects, their properties and how to work with them in the first case, computation and more applied mathematics solutions for the second).
  - mnemonicsloth 6y ago
    It turns out the brain actually likes to see concepts broken into pieces and spread out all over the place. To use your example, a better way to learn those things would have been a couple of projects where you used them all together, over and over.
- JSavageOne 6y ago
  Counterpoint: my 2 favorite classes in undergrad were both general education courses - "World Regions" (had a super charismatic professor so wouldn't necessarily recommend this course at any random university) and "Morality & Justice".
  - DoofusOfDeath 6y ago
    Did you really mean "World Regions", or instead "World Religions"?
    - gowld 6y ago
      Hageography ;-)
    - JSavageOne 6y ago
      Yes "Regions". The course covered geopolitics, current events, etc. The course and professor were famous at the university. The course material itself was interesting because it covered current events in detail, but the real reason for the class's popularity was that the professor was incredibly entertaining. Attending a lecture was sort of like watching an episode of Stephen Colbert, except deeper with more focus on learning than just pure entertainment.
  - mcguire 6y ago
    "Contemporary Moral Problems" with a professor who resembles Captain Kangaroo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Kangaroo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Kangaroo).
- mcguire 6y ago
  Was Library Science required, or was it a general requirement that you picked Library Science for? (Having a hard time seeing Library Science as a specific requirement.)
  - charlesdaniels 6y ago
    FWIW I completed my undergraduate degree in 2019, and I was required to take library science specifically. It was a half-semester course that taught students how to use the library. I guess the value is it means the students have no excuse to not know how to find library resources, but I feel like most people in the class were generally familiar with the idea of a library and how to use it.
    - ocdtrekkie 6y ago
      This sounds somewhat similar to other "college success" first year courses that are more about how to do research papers than anything else. A proper introduction to Library Science is about how to run a library...
      - p1esk 6y ago
        Good point. It would be an utter disappointment for me to take this class only to sit through explanations on how to find a book in a library (something I was able to do when I was 8).
  - AnimalMuppet 6y ago
    It filled a general ed slot, I think. Or else I just wanted a super-easy class. It wasn't required. And yes, it really was "how to use a card catalog". (Hey, I'm old. It really was cards.)
- alexbanks 6y ago
  If you go into something with a set of beliefs and are only looking to confirm them, you probably won't gain anything.
frogpelt 6y ago
I could say it about Macroeconomics and English 102 but only because I had awesome teachers. I can say that one of my Calculus classes and my other English classes made me want to quit school. The teachers were horrible; either arrogant and condescending or incompetent at teaching (which made us a bad pair because I was an incompetent student at times).

You can say the same thing about any single lower undergraduate subject.

by p1esk 6y ago

You can say the same thing about any single lower undergraduate subject.

I took a class in Library Science. It didn't change my outlook on anything. It only confirmed my belief in the wastefulness of certain general ed requirements. Economic history didn't do much for me, either. (Now, granted, that could be eye-opening, for at least some people, if taught well and with solid content. But in my case, for that class... meh.)

p1esk 6y ago
It didn't change my outlook on anything Someone can say this about any single lower undergraduate subject :) p.s. Library Science course would have been an eye-opening experience for me, given my fascination with books and libraries when I was a teenager.
- vonseel 6y ago
  I’m not sure how fascinating it gets beyond the Dewey Decimal system, lol. There’s probably some cool stuff with document preservation and archiving. But so much of library science seems outdated now that most information is on the internet. What they really need is a better system for internet research, the UIs those systems use last time I worked in a library on a project was terrible.
agumonkey 6y ago
should we (could we) compress higher education ? I found a lot of redundancy by splitting things in modules. (uml, oop, sql felt like 3 sides of the same hypercoin, granted the first 2 may disappear from books soon). algorithmics and mathematics (and other topics) may be merged into one ? or maybe that would be pedagogically detrimental.. I feel that it would allow more time to spend on a concept since you don't have to see bits scattered in different courses.
- gizmo686 6y ago
  No student learns everything that university teaches; there is simply not enough time. It would be ideal if each student received a perfectly customized curriculum; but that is simply not practical to do. Instead, universities have a modular system; where different students can mix and match modules to cover what they are interested in. Similarly, different majors can mix and match required module to cover the material that is nessasary for said majors. In the case of subjects with a very large number of students, it is possible to produce specialized modules, so you might have a university offer a separate probability-for-scientists and probability-for-mathematicians classes that it considers to be interchangable, but differs in how it covers the subject/what background it assumes.
- tsimionescu 6y ago
  I'm not sure how oop and sql would be the same thing - they are famously incompatible (object/relational impedance mismatch). UML is just a graphical notation, I would agree it doesn't make sense as a separate course. When you say algorithmics and mathematics, do you mean all of computer science and all of maths? Do you think a single course should cover, say, Dijkstra's algorithm and partial differential equations? Usually, each course already covers a wide array of concepts. I can't think of a single concept that was explored by different bits in different courses. The closest I can think of are 2 courses I had, one of which was focused on analytical solutions for linear algebra (matrices), and the other focused on numerical solutions to the same problems. Even then, the split did make sense, since they were focused on different concepts (mathematical objects, their properties and how to work with them in the first case, computation and more applied mathematics solutions for the second).
- mnemonicsloth 6y ago
  It turns out the brain actually likes to see concepts broken into pieces and spread out all over the place. To use your example, a better way to learn those things would have been a couple of projects where you used them all together, over and over.
JSavageOne 6y ago
Counterpoint: my 2 favorite classes in undergrad were both general education courses - "World Regions" (had a super charismatic professor so wouldn't necessarily recommend this course at any random university) and "Morality & Justice".
- DoofusOfDeath 6y ago
  Did you really mean "World Regions", or instead "World Religions"?
  - gowld 6y ago
    Hageography ;-)
  - JSavageOne 6y ago
    Yes "Regions". The course covered geopolitics, current events, etc. The course and professor were famous at the university. The course material itself was interesting because it covered current events in detail, but the real reason for the class's popularity was that the professor was incredibly entertaining. Attending a lecture was sort of like watching an episode of Stephen Colbert, except deeper with more focus on learning than just pure entertainment.
- mcguire 6y ago
  "Contemporary Moral Problems" with a professor who resembles Captain Kangaroo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Kangaroo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Kangaroo).
mcguire 6y ago
Was Library Science required, or was it a general requirement that you picked Library Science for? (Having a hard time seeing Library Science as a specific requirement.)
- charlesdaniels 6y ago
  FWIW I completed my undergraduate degree in 2019, and I was required to take library science specifically. It was a half-semester course that taught students how to use the library. I guess the value is it means the students have no excuse to not know how to find library resources, but I feel like most people in the class were generally familiar with the idea of a library and how to use it.
  - ocdtrekkie 6y ago
    This sounds somewhat similar to other "college success" first year courses that are more about how to do research papers than anything else. A proper introduction to Library Science is about how to run a library...
    - p1esk 6y ago
      Good point. It would be an utter disappointment for me to take this class only to sit through explanations on how to find a book in a library (something I was able to do when I was 8).
- AnimalMuppet 6y ago
  It filled a general ed slot, I think. Or else I just wanted a super-easy class. It wasn't required. And yes, it really was "how to use a card catalog". (Hey, I'm old. It really was cards.)
alexbanks 6y ago
If you go into something with a set of beliefs and are only looking to confirm them, you probably won't gain anything.

frogpelt 6y ago

I could say it about Macroeconomics and English 102 but only because I had awesome teachers. I can say that one of my Calculus classes and my other English classes made me want to quit school. The teachers were horrible; either arrogant and condescending or incompetent at teaching (which made us a bad pair because I was an incompetent student at times).