5 ms·

I recall hearing of an Italian saying, something like this: Either get a mocha pot at home, or get a real espresso machine and open a coffee shop.

by donut 6y ago

lultimouomo 6y ago
I think this is much less true now than it was 10 years ago. On the positive side, capsule-based espresso machines do deliver consistent, good quality coffee at home, better than you would get with a consumer espresso machine using pre-ground coffee that you keep in a vat for a couple of weeks. On the negative side, I am often disappointed by the quality of espresso in (Italian) coffee shops. It used to be that the quality of coffee was paramount for a coffee shop, and a good barista either learned how to get good coffee quickly or went home; now it seems this is perceived as a much less important part of the trade, and you regularly get restaurant-quality (as in very mediocre) coffee in coffee shops. Not sure if Nespresso played a role in this too, as less people are walking to a shop to get their coffee.
- Heliosmaster 6y ago
  (italian here) completely agree. It's not very easy to find a coffee shop where the espresso doesn't taste burnt. I have the feeling the baristas have good technique, but the machines don't get cleaned / serviced enough. Or maybe it's just me, trying more and more different coffee places around europe.
  - ntsplnkv2 6y ago
    > Or maybe it's just me, trying more and more different coffee places around europe. There are some truly great coffee experiences in the US and Australia too - really stretching boundaries, or doing the classic style, much better than in Italy. It seems that Italy has been less innovative in this space - probably because it is "Just coffee" in the way drip is in the US - it is more functional, which is sad, because truly great espresso is a treat.
- toyg 6y ago
  > It used to be that the quality of coffee was paramount for a coffee shop Italian cities used to be "large towns", where people lived and talked to each other - which meant a low-quality bar would whither and die while good ones thrived, since word of mouth and time availability would allow people to be selective. These areas are now increasingly adopting suburban models, forced by growth and new ways of life. People commute to work, get coffee quickly from the closest bar or from vending machines inside their offices and capannoni, then go back to the 'burbs. There is rarely time to be selective and go "da quello che lo fa buono". Also, in my experience, a lot of bars now make money (and their name) on the 7pm aperitivo rather than on espresso.
- dahauns 6y ago
  Damn, has the quality really gone down this much in the last decade? :( I haven't been there for, well more than a decade, but coming from Vienna, one of the greatest things when visiting Italy (and what I missed most when I was back home) was that you usually got good espresso even in the smallest shack in the middle of nowhere.
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  > On the negative side, I am often disappointed by the quality of espresso in (Italian) coffee shops. In general I agree. It seems that other areas have been doing much more in this space in the US, Australia, etc. At home I like to do things more in the Italian style - but with higher quality beans, and the difference is remarkable.

I recall hearing of an Italian saying, something like this: Either get a mocha pot at home, or get a real espresso machine and open a coffee shop.

by donut 6y ago

I recall hearing of an Italian saying, something like this: Either get a mocha pot at home, or get a real espresso machine and open a coffee shop.

lultimouomo 6y ago

I think this is much less true now than it was 10 years ago. On the positive side, capsule-based espresso machines do deliver consistent, good quality coffee at home, better than you would get with a consumer espresso machine using pre-ground coffee that you keep in a vat for a couple of weeks. On the negative side, I am often disappointed by the quality of espresso in (Italian) coffee shops. It used to be that the quality of coffee was paramount for a coffee shop, and a good barista either learned how to get good coffee quickly or went home; now it seems this is perceived as a much less important part of the trade, and you regularly get restaurant-quality (as in very mediocre) coffee in coffee shops. Not sure if Nespresso played a role in this too, as less people are walking to a shop to get their coffee.

Heliosmaster 6y ago
(italian here) completely agree. It's not very easy to find a coffee shop where the espresso doesn't taste burnt. I have the feeling the baristas have good technique, but the machines don't get cleaned / serviced enough. Or maybe it's just me, trying more and more different coffee places around europe.
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  > Or maybe it's just me, trying more and more different coffee places around europe. There are some truly great coffee experiences in the US and Australia too - really stretching boundaries, or doing the classic style, much better than in Italy. It seems that Italy has been less innovative in this space - probably because it is "Just coffee" in the way drip is in the US - it is more functional, which is sad, because truly great espresso is a treat.
toyg 6y ago
> It used to be that the quality of coffee was paramount for a coffee shop Italian cities used to be "large towns", where people lived and talked to each other - which meant a low-quality bar would whither and die while good ones thrived, since word of mouth and time availability would allow people to be selective. These areas are now increasingly adopting suburban models, forced by growth and new ways of life. People commute to work, get coffee quickly from the closest bar or from vending machines inside their offices and capannoni, then go back to the 'burbs. There is rarely time to be selective and go "da quello che lo fa buono". Also, in my experience, a lot of bars now make money (and their name) on the 7pm aperitivo rather than on espresso.
dahauns 6y ago
Damn, has the quality really gone down this much in the last decade? :( I haven't been there for, well more than a decade, but coming from Vienna, one of the greatest things when visiting Italy (and what I missed most when I was back home) was that you usually got good espresso even in the smallest shack in the middle of nowhere.
ntsplnkv2 6y ago
> On the negative side, I am often disappointed by the quality of espresso in (Italian) coffee shops. In general I agree. It seems that other areas have been doing much more in this space in the US, Australia, etc. At home I like to do things more in the Italian style - but with higher quality beans, and the difference is remarkable.