11 ms·

I understand that, in some sense, this may be true. But notice that it doesn't say that not being grumpy is a recipe for failure. I personally prefer to be goo

by ldd 6y ago

I understand that, in some sense, this may be true. But notice that it doesn't say that not being grumpy is a recipe for failure. I personally prefer to be good-tempered and not grumpy, and I am rarely in a bad mood. I call this dog philosophy. It probably means that I won't have all the success and greatness and stuff that others have, but overall, I am much more content seeing the world through rose-coloured glasses. My dog seems to agree.

Florin_Andrei 6y ago
Evolution came up with a range of tools that each work best in different situations. If you're never kind, collaboration and group effort become hard. People don't want to join you. You will miss opportunities to strengthen your group. In the long run, your line will lose out. If you're never "grumpy" or bad tempered or forceful, you'll just get obliterated eventually by some great force randomly sweeping the neighborhood. Do not think it never happens. Sometimes the best response is force. And then there's everything else in between. It's a range, and all components are there for a reason - they performed well in the evolutionary past, so they got included in the toolkit. Use it, and use it wisely. The optimum is not a narrow point - it's a wide range of diverse responses. Width is crucial.
ryandvm 6y ago
Heh. I've used a very similar "live like a dog" philosophy myself to try to emulate the best traits of canine personality. Dogs are loyal and eager to please, they don't dwell on the past, they don't hold grudges, they aren't retributive. That said, you have to be careful not to take it too seriously. Dogs are terrible philanthropists, they suck at planning, they aren't rational, they hate to share, etc.
- netcan 6y ago
  Reading your comment, I realized how squarely I fall into the grumpy group. Grudgingly agreed to the first part, the second part made me giggle.
- glial 6y ago
  Love it, and maybe you have heard of Diogenes and the Cynics (literally 'dog-like'). "There are four reasons why the Cynics are so named. First because of the indifference of their way of life, for they make a cult of indifference and, like dogs, eat and make love in public, go barefoot, and sleep in tubs and at crossroads. The second reason is that the dog is a shameless animal, and they make a cult of shamelessness, not as being beneath modesty, but as superior to it. The third reason is that the dog is a good guard, and they guard the tenets of their philosophy. The fourth reason is that the dog is a discriminating animal which can distinguish between its friends and enemies. So do they recognize as friends those who are suited to philosophy, and receive them kindly, while those unfitted they drive away, like dogs, by barking at them."[0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes#Diogenes_as_dogged_or_dog-like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes#Diogenes_as_dogged_or...
- cgriswald 6y ago
  Even the 'best traits of canine personality'... aren't even true in a general sense. That's more of a human conception of the end result of natural tendencies, training, anthropomorphism, and how dogs are portrayed in the media. > Dogs are loyal and eager to please... I foster, train, and board dogs. Trust me when I say this idea that dogs are 'loyal and eager to please' is very specific to certain breeds (e.g. Goldens). Most breeds only become 'loyal and eager to please' if their owner is clearly in charge. I generally foster huskies. They've all been either from a puppy mill or have been feral (so in either case they have no real human interaction before I get them) and they don't really have any interest in what I want at all until they've been with me and trained for awhile. > they don't dwell on the past... Dogs don't not dwell on the past, either. They're more or less completely unaware of it. However they experienced an event doesn't become a memory that they later recall. However they interpreted those events at the time had its influence on their future behavior and they can never go back and re-examine that event. They do have a sense of time, but it's not like ours. It's based on smell. "That girl dog I like was here, but the scent has faded, so she was here, but she's not now."
  - baggy_trough 6y ago
    > Dogs don't not dwell on the past, either. They're more or less completely unaware of it. However they experienced an event doesn't become a memory that they later recall. However they interpreted those events at the time had its influence on their future behavior and they can never go back and re-examine that event. They do have a sense of time, but it's not like ours. It's based on smell. What is the evidence for this?
    - cgriswald 6y ago
      As a for-instance: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29261497/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29261497/ The article is in French, but the abstract is in English. If you search for "animals" and "episodic memory"[0] (the type of memory you think of as a 'memory') you'll find a lot of studies claiming no animals other than humans have episodic memory. I'm not certain that's entirely true (and a lot of the studies will have caveats). If you search for "dogs" and "episodic memory" you'll find some disagreement as well; not arguing that dogs have human-like memory, but more that whether an animal has "episodic memory" isn't binary (e.g., https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960982216311423 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096098221... ). Also interesting is this study on short term memory in animals: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0376635714003027 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S03766... [0] - https://www.livescience.com/43713-memory.html https://www.livescience.com/43713-memory.html Edit: Fixed links.
- coffeefirst 6y ago
  There's something to this. My beagle always remembers to stop and smell the roses. And then pee on the roses.
  - cgriswald 6y ago
    I’m sorry to be the one to tell you this, but it’s not the roses they are sniffing...
- nanomonkey 6y ago
  Don't forget, take frequent naps and sprint as hard as you can when you get to some green grass. Dogs definitely live in the moment, who else would ask for a full body massage when they meet new/old friends.
elliekelly 6y ago
I have a friend who has an analogous “goldfish philosophy” for giving grumpy people the benefit of the doubt: when someone acts like a jerk he says “maybe their goldfish died this morning” and then forgets the incident as fast a goldfish would. You never know who’s having a bad day and he genuinely doesn’t take it personally. Of course sometimes he jokes that a person is a “goldfish serial killer” which means they’re a confirmed jerk.
mattnewton 6y ago
I would feel deeply insulted if someone compared me to a dog because of complacency, but to each their own. Whatever works for you, though I can't say I understand. I will say I find less grumpy people easier to work with and I try to be pleasant to everyone I work with as a result; it's just the dog messaging I find confusing.

by ldd 6y ago

Florin_Andrei 6y ago

Evolution came up with a range of tools that each work best in different situations. If you're never kind, collaboration and group effort become hard. People don't want to join you. You will miss opportunities to strengthen your group. In the long run, your line will lose out. If you're never "grumpy" or bad tempered or forceful, you'll just get obliterated eventually by some great force randomly sweeping the neighborhood. Do not think it never happens. Sometimes the best response is force. And then there's everything else in between. It's a range, and all components are there for a reason - they performed well in the evolutionary past, so they got included in the toolkit. Use it, and use it wisely. The optimum is not a narrow point - it's a wide range of diverse responses. Width is crucial.

ryandvm 6y ago

Heh. I've used a very similar "live like a dog" philosophy myself to try to emulate the best traits of canine personality. Dogs are loyal and eager to please, they don't dwell on the past, they don't hold grudges, they aren't retributive. That said, you have to be careful not to take it too seriously. Dogs are terrible philanthropists, they suck at planning, they aren't rational, they hate to share, etc.

netcan 6y ago
Reading your comment, I realized how squarely I fall into the grumpy group. Grudgingly agreed to the first part, the second part made me giggle.
glial 6y ago
Love it, and maybe you have heard of Diogenes and the Cynics (literally 'dog-like'). "There are four reasons why the Cynics are so named. First because of the indifference of their way of life, for they make a cult of indifference and, like dogs, eat and make love in public, go barefoot, and sleep in tubs and at crossroads. The second reason is that the dog is a shameless animal, and they make a cult of shamelessness, not as being beneath modesty, but as superior to it. The third reason is that the dog is a good guard, and they guard the tenets of their philosophy. The fourth reason is that the dog is a discriminating animal which can distinguish between its friends and enemies. So do they recognize as friends those who are suited to philosophy, and receive them kindly, while those unfitted they drive away, like dogs, by barking at them."[0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes#Diogenes_as_dogged_or_dog-like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes#Diogenes_as_dogged_or...
cgriswald 6y ago
Even the 'best traits of canine personality'... aren't even true in a general sense. That's more of a human conception of the end result of natural tendencies, training, anthropomorphism, and how dogs are portrayed in the media. > Dogs are loyal and eager to please... I foster, train, and board dogs. Trust me when I say this idea that dogs are 'loyal and eager to please' is very specific to certain breeds (e.g. Goldens). Most breeds only become 'loyal and eager to please' if their owner is clearly in charge. I generally foster huskies. They've all been either from a puppy mill or have been feral (so in either case they have no real human interaction before I get them) and they don't really have any interest in what I want at all until they've been with me and trained for awhile. > they don't dwell on the past... Dogs don't not dwell on the past, either. They're more or less completely unaware of it. However they experienced an event doesn't become a memory that they later recall. However they interpreted those events at the time had its influence on their future behavior and they can never go back and re-examine that event. They do have a sense of time, but it's not like ours. It's based on smell. "That girl dog I like was here, but the scent has faded, so she was here, but she's not now."
- baggy_trough 6y ago
  > Dogs don't not dwell on the past, either. They're more or less completely unaware of it. However they experienced an event doesn't become a memory that they later recall. However they interpreted those events at the time had its influence on their future behavior and they can never go back and re-examine that event. They do have a sense of time, but it's not like ours. It's based on smell. What is the evidence for this?
  - cgriswald 6y ago
    As a for-instance: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29261497/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29261497/ The article is in French, but the abstract is in English. If you search for "animals" and "episodic memory"[0] (the type of memory you think of as a 'memory') you'll find a lot of studies claiming no animals other than humans have episodic memory. I'm not certain that's entirely true (and a lot of the studies will have caveats). If you search for "dogs" and "episodic memory" you'll find some disagreement as well; not arguing that dogs have human-like memory, but more that whether an animal has "episodic memory" isn't binary (e.g., https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960982216311423 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096098221... ). Also interesting is this study on short term memory in animals: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0376635714003027 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S03766... [0] - https://www.livescience.com/43713-memory.html https://www.livescience.com/43713-memory.html Edit: Fixed links.
coffeefirst 6y ago
There's something to this. My beagle always remembers to stop and smell the roses. And then pee on the roses.
- cgriswald 6y ago
  I’m sorry to be the one to tell you this, but it’s not the roses they are sniffing...
nanomonkey 6y ago
Don't forget, take frequent naps and sprint as hard as you can when you get to some green grass. Dogs definitely live in the moment, who else would ask for a full body massage when they meet new/old friends.

elliekelly 6y ago

I have a friend who has an analogous “goldfish philosophy” for giving grumpy people the benefit of the doubt: when someone acts like a jerk he says “maybe their goldfish died this morning” and then forgets the incident as fast a goldfish would. You never know who’s having a bad day and he genuinely doesn’t take it personally. Of course sometimes he jokes that a person is a “goldfish serial killer” which means they’re a confirmed jerk.

mattnewton 6y ago

I would feel deeply insulted if someone compared me to a dog because of complacency, but to each their own. Whatever works for you, though I can't say I understand. I will say I find less grumpy people easier to work with and I try to be pleasant to everyone I work with as a result; it's just the dog messaging I find confusing.