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The company only looks out for itself and will support you only when it benefits. It will never benefit from supporting an ex-employee that left on bad terms, a

The company only looks out for itself and will support you only when it benefits. It will never benefit from supporting an ex-employee that left on bad terms, and the ex-employee will never benefit either from supporting it. So why bother, there is no rational reason. The bond to co-workers at a former workplace is strange and tenuous - actually it goes the other way around, they reach out to you when they want to improve their situation. Let them ask you when they want out, then offer a hand.

jedberg 6y ago
> and the ex-employee will never benefit either from supporting it. Like I said, even when you get fired, you still have stock options. So you do in fact benefit by helping the company when you're leaving. > The bond to co-workers at a former workplace is strange and tenuous - actually it goes the other way around, they reach out to you when they want to improve their situation. Let them ask you when they want out, then offer a hand. Why not offer them help when they don't ask, in the form of giving feedback to HR? Why do they need to ask? Why can't I be altruistic and help just because? I'll say this -- you're entitled to your opinion, but I really hope I never work with or for someone who shares your outlook. And I especially hope I never manage someone with your outlook. Whatever happened to "we're all in this together"?
- stuxnet79 6y ago
  > Whatever happened to "we're all in this together"? Because we are not in this together. I like working in collaborative environments but after switching jobs more times than I can count I've become more cynical. - Co-workers are not your friends. - HR is not your friend. - Management is not your friend. It's a business relationship and in the eyes of the corporate structure you are just a fungible resource being consumed to produce shareholder value. Some companies do a great job of creating a "culture" but even in these companies it's only a thin veneer over the machiavellian tactics that keep the corporate machine chugging along.
  - ehmish 6y ago
    I'd disagree with that, management and HR, sure, but friendship with co-workers is important. Personal relationships are the main way people find jobs, and unlike with management and HR with co-workers at least nominally you're on the same team
  - discordance 6y ago
    That sounds like a pretty horrible existence. I often spend more time with my colleagues than my family, and luckily I have formed great friendships with them. I care about them and vice versa. This contributes greatly to my quality of life. Luckily we all have decent jobs that we enjoy that presents interesting challenges, and earn a decent amount too.
- quadrifoliate 6y ago
  I'm sorry, but you're j"I worked at Reddit and Netflix"edberg. I am a schmoe who works in a small town where there are fewer than 10 good companies that I would want to work for, and you haven't heard of any of them. From the average perspective, I have found the parent's commenter's advice to be far more accurate. I don't think you have a good idea of how terrible and vindictive the average mid-level paper pusher in management or HR is outside Silicon Valley (I suspect there are quite a few in SV as well, but maybe you all are a little more skeptical about their utility). I don't want some maniac manager talking crap about me to everyone they know and consequently blowing up my meager job prospects just because I complained to HR about their shitty management style. Oh, and unlike your Netflix example, tens of people complained about terrible management style at a former employer, and not a single manager got fired or even cautioned as a result. So I'm going to smile, nod, and leave a company – nothing more. So, in summary – hopefully this doesn't sound like flattery, but consider that you might be in the position of a Lakers player giving advice to a local pickup basketball group. The advice doesn't always translate well to a different context :)
  - jedberg 6y ago
    That is a completely fair and relevant assessment. I don't know what it is like to work in small town with few job prospects. I would hope I would act the same in that situation, trying to make things better for everyone, but honestly I don't know. Hopefully the rise of remote work will fix some of this, giving you more prospects outside of your small town, and more flexibility. > So, in summary – hopefully this doesn't sound like flattery, but consider that you might be in the position of a Lakers player giving advice to a local pickup basketball group. Aw man, thanks for that ego boost today. I'll try not to let it go to my head. :) But seriously, I always try to give advice that is generally relevant, because I am self-aware enough to know that just about every situation I've been in is not the norm. But thank you for calling me out, because sometimes I still make poor assumptions.
    - quadrifoliate 6y ago
      > Hopefully the rise of remote work will fix some of this, giving you more prospects outside of your small town, and more flexibility. Thanks! I hope so too. :)

jedberg 6y ago

> and the ex-employee will never benefit either from supporting it. Like I said, even when you get fired, you still have stock options. So you do in fact benefit by helping the company when you're leaving. > The bond to co-workers at a former workplace is strange and tenuous - actually it goes the other way around, they reach out to you when they want to improve their situation. Let them ask you when they want out, then offer a hand. Why not offer them help when they don't ask, in the form of giving feedback to HR? Why do they need to ask? Why can't I be altruistic and help just because? I'll say this -- you're entitled to your opinion, but I really hope I never work with or for someone who shares your outlook. And I especially hope I never manage someone with your outlook. Whatever happened to "we're all in this together"?

stuxnet79 6y ago
> Whatever happened to "we're all in this together"? Because we are not in this together. I like working in collaborative environments but after switching jobs more times than I can count I've become more cynical. - Co-workers are not your friends. - HR is not your friend. - Management is not your friend. It's a business relationship and in the eyes of the corporate structure you are just a fungible resource being consumed to produce shareholder value. Some companies do a great job of creating a "culture" but even in these companies it's only a thin veneer over the machiavellian tactics that keep the corporate machine chugging along.
- ehmish 6y ago
  I'd disagree with that, management and HR, sure, but friendship with co-workers is important. Personal relationships are the main way people find jobs, and unlike with management and HR with co-workers at least nominally you're on the same team
- discordance 6y ago
  That sounds like a pretty horrible existence. I often spend more time with my colleagues than my family, and luckily I have formed great friendships with them. I care about them and vice versa. This contributes greatly to my quality of life. Luckily we all have decent jobs that we enjoy that presents interesting challenges, and earn a decent amount too.
quadrifoliate 6y ago
I'm sorry, but you're j"I worked at Reddit and Netflix"edberg. I am a schmoe who works in a small town where there are fewer than 10 good companies that I would want to work for, and you haven't heard of any of them. From the average perspective, I have found the parent's commenter's advice to be far more accurate. I don't think you have a good idea of how terrible and vindictive the average mid-level paper pusher in management or HR is outside Silicon Valley (I suspect there are quite a few in SV as well, but maybe you all are a little more skeptical about their utility). I don't want some maniac manager talking crap about me to everyone they know and consequently blowing up my meager job prospects just because I complained to HR about their shitty management style. Oh, and unlike your Netflix example, tens of people complained about terrible management style at a former employer, and not a single manager got fired or even cautioned as a result. So I'm going to smile, nod, and leave a company – nothing more. So, in summary – hopefully this doesn't sound like flattery, but consider that you might be in the position of a Lakers player giving advice to a local pickup basketball group. The advice doesn't always translate well to a different context :)
- jedberg 6y ago
  That is a completely fair and relevant assessment. I don't know what it is like to work in small town with few job prospects. I would hope I would act the same in that situation, trying to make things better for everyone, but honestly I don't know. Hopefully the rise of remote work will fix some of this, giving you more prospects outside of your small town, and more flexibility. > So, in summary – hopefully this doesn't sound like flattery, but consider that you might be in the position of a Lakers player giving advice to a local pickup basketball group. Aw man, thanks for that ego boost today. I'll try not to let it go to my head. :) But seriously, I always try to give advice that is generally relevant, because I am self-aware enough to know that just about every situation I've been in is not the norm. But thank you for calling me out, because sometimes I still make poor assumptions.
  - quadrifoliate 6y ago
    > Hopefully the rise of remote work will fix some of this, giving you more prospects outside of your small town, and more flexibility. Thanks! I hope so too. :)