4 ms·

Of course. What purpose does the downvote button serve? If the post is breaking the rules, you should report/flag it. If its not, you shouldn't downvote.

elliekelly 6y ago
What about when a post isn’t breaking the rules but is factually incorrect? If I comment that the earth is flat or that the sun revolves around the moon I would expect that comment to be filtered out by the community rather than something to bother the mods about.
- goalieca 6y ago
  I've seen downvotes that are applied to factually correct information but that goes against the herd. A simple rebuttal would suffice as we tend to do in the technical stories. Political stories on this site are insufferable.
  - malandrew 6y ago
    Regardless of where you stand on a situation, advocacy is unavoidable in political stories. You can be 100% factually correct, but still commit sins of advocacy and partisanship like omitting factual information or misrepresenting factual information. About the only comments that remain factually accurate without committing sins of advocacy in political stories are those that acknowledge that the issue is complicated, that there are many sides and that there isn't anything conclusive. The more certain/convicted about an issue a commenter comes, the more likely they are going to get downvoted in political stories. My observation is that those comments that practice the principle of charity with their interlocutors are those that are more likely to be upvoted. How you say something is more important than what you're saying if you're trying to reach common understanding in earnest. Technical stories generally don't have positions and advocacy except advocacy in favor of intellectual curiosity.
  - MisterBastahrd 6y ago
    There's data that is factually correct but contextually useless in a vacuum to the point of being harmful when cited for advocacy reasons. It's not difficult to figure out when people cite that data and why.
- bluGill 6y ago
  What about claims that small rocks fall at the same speed as heavy rocks? That is something true that everybody incorrectly thinks is false.
  - fsflover 6y ago
    If you show proofs, you typically will not get downvoted.
acheron 6y ago
It's to cut down on the tedious arguments. If someone posts something stupid, you could get into a long, drawn-out argument with them that goes nowhere and clutters up the comments, or you just click downvote and move on. Same reason for upvoting rather than "posting 'me too' like some brain-dead AOLer". [0] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpMvS1Q1sos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpMvS1Q1sos
peatmoss 6y ago
I think the idea is that downvotes require a minimum level of karma (and thus ideally habituation to Hacker News norms around not simply downvoting content that you disagree with). But... I don’t always see that being applied. I regularly upvote graying content that I vehemently disagree with if the commenter is making an earnest point in a respectful way. I do sometimes wish that the downvote button came with a selection box for what norm was being violated, because I think downvotes should require more thought and carry a little more friction. That said, a friend asked me just yesterday if HN was the last place on the Internet I still comment, and I realized it is. On balance, I find the discourse and application of voting to be generally acceptable and better than other forums that I’ve mostly given up on.
p1necone 6y ago
It's an important stand in for what would happen in real life conversation, but can't in the same way online. Awkward silence, confused/upset looks, a muttered "what the fuck dude" etc.
dpifke 6y ago
I downvote comments which I think don't add anything to the conversation. Lately I find myself downvoting comments which try to interject U.S. politics—of any ideological stripe—into discussions of non-political topics. I don't think the commentators are "breaking the rules," per se, but they aren't contributing positively. I'm sure they feel their political opinion is being suppressed, but my votes reflect that I come here for technical insights, not politics.
prepend 6y ago
In face to face situations there’s way to express disapproval. Downvotes let people express their displeasure with a comment. When only upvotes exist, it’s very difficult to remove bad content. It also favors vapid, pleasing posts that will easily get upvotes.

elliekelly 6y ago

What about when a post isn’t breaking the rules but is factually incorrect? If I comment that the earth is flat or that the sun revolves around the moon I would expect that comment to be filtered out by the community rather than something to bother the mods about.

goalieca 6y ago
I've seen downvotes that are applied to factually correct information but that goes against the herd. A simple rebuttal would suffice as we tend to do in the technical stories. Political stories on this site are insufferable.
- malandrew 6y ago
  Regardless of where you stand on a situation, advocacy is unavoidable in political stories. You can be 100% factually correct, but still commit sins of advocacy and partisanship like omitting factual information or misrepresenting factual information. About the only comments that remain factually accurate without committing sins of advocacy in political stories are those that acknowledge that the issue is complicated, that there are many sides and that there isn't anything conclusive. The more certain/convicted about an issue a commenter comes, the more likely they are going to get downvoted in political stories. My observation is that those comments that practice the principle of charity with their interlocutors are those that are more likely to be upvoted. How you say something is more important than what you're saying if you're trying to reach common understanding in earnest. Technical stories generally don't have positions and advocacy except advocacy in favor of intellectual curiosity.
- MisterBastahrd 6y ago
  There's data that is factually correct but contextually useless in a vacuum to the point of being harmful when cited for advocacy reasons. It's not difficult to figure out when people cite that data and why.
bluGill 6y ago
What about claims that small rocks fall at the same speed as heavy rocks? That is something true that everybody incorrectly thinks is false.
- fsflover 6y ago
  If you show proofs, you typically will not get downvoted.

acheron 6y ago

It's to cut down on the tedious arguments. If someone posts something stupid, you could get into a long, drawn-out argument with them that goes nowhere and clutters up the comments, or you just click downvote and move on. Same reason for upvoting rather than "posting 'me too' like some brain-dead AOLer". [0] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpMvS1Q1sos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpMvS1Q1sos

peatmoss 6y ago

I think the idea is that downvotes require a minimum level of karma (and thus ideally habituation to Hacker News norms around not simply downvoting content that you disagree with). But... I don’t always see that being applied. I regularly upvote graying content that I vehemently disagree with if the commenter is making an earnest point in a respectful way. I do sometimes wish that the downvote button came with a selection box for what norm was being violated, because I think downvotes should require more thought and carry a little more friction. That said, a friend asked me just yesterday if HN was the last place on the Internet I still comment, and I realized it is. On balance, I find the discourse and application of voting to be generally acceptable and better than other forums that I’ve mostly given up on.

p1necone 6y ago

It's an important stand in for what would happen in real life conversation, but can't in the same way online. Awkward silence, confused/upset looks, a muttered "what the fuck dude" etc.

dpifke 6y ago

I downvote comments which I think don't add anything to the conversation. Lately I find myself downvoting comments which try to interject U.S. politics—of any ideological stripe—into discussions of non-political topics. I don't think the commentators are "breaking the rules," per se, but they aren't contributing positively. I'm sure they feel their political opinion is being suppressed, but my votes reflect that I come here for technical insights, not politics.

prepend 6y ago

In face to face situations there’s way to express disapproval. Downvotes let people express their displeasure with a comment. When only upvotes exist, it’s very difficult to remove bad content. It also favors vapid, pleasing posts that will easily get upvotes.