4 ms·

They'll appeal most likely but their chances of success look slim.

oblio 6y ago
It could be. But they're only going to piss off the EU even more with these moves. Right now Apple is probably winning a battle but might be losing the war. The next big EU mandate, besides tackling climate change, will probably be clamping down on tax shenanigans. Next time they won't even be able to win anything as the law will be explicitly against such corporate maneuvers.
- stormdennis 6y ago
  The commission isn't all powerful. There are different national interests in Europe and all countries have a veto on such matters I believe
  - matthewheath 6y ago
    > all countries have a veto on such matters I believe In most cases, a veto can't happen unless the following conditions are met: 1) Less than 55% of total Member States (less than 15) voting AND 2) The voting Member States represent less than 65% of the total EU population AND (assuming at least one of the conditions above aren't met) 3) At least four countries vote to block the measure OR (if not all countries are voting) 4) The minimum number of countries that represent more than 35% of the total EU population, plus one country, vote to block the measure. This prevents e.g. 3 big countries from blocking the others.
    - stormdennis 6y ago
      The rules you quote do not apply to matters of taxation, I believe which is a power reserved to national governments.
- marcyb5st 6y ago
  Are you sure? I think that countries that benefit from such schemes (e.g. Ireland, Netherlands, Luxembourg) can veto, sink such proposals before they land, or simply partially comply. For instance, the Netherlands announced a withholding tax on royalties for 2021 "for cases where abuse is involved" [1] after international pressure. The way I read this is that they are building a facade where it looks they are complying with other EU regulations, but in reality it's business as usual. This way other EU countries have no appeal to these schemes as the Netherlands can say "we looked into these allegations, but no abuse there" and do nothing. [1] https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Documents/Tax/dttl-tax-netherlandshighlights-2019.pdf https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Docume...
  - oblio 6y ago
    There are countries that benefit from it, and they can veto. However, the reality is... realpolitik still exists. If Germany and France decide things should really change, what negotiating power do you think the Netherlands or Luxembourg or Ireland really have? For example the Dutch economy is basically hitched to the German one, Germany can find a lot of creative ways to inflict a lot of pain on the Netherlands if it really wants to ;-)
    - alphadevx 6y ago
      Let me introduce you to the New Hanseatic League, you will be surprised what an aligned group of small countries within the EU can achieve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Hanseatic_League https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Hanseatic_League
    - stormdennis 6y ago
      Alliances vary according to the issue. Germany and France are often at loggerheads. France has a particular beef with with Ireland's 12% corporation tax rate but agrees with it on lots of other issues such as agriculture and the measures concerning the pandemic. Ireland passed up on a chance to join the Hanseatic league[1] because in some ways it is not as "Northern European" in outlook as he likes of Finland and the Netherlands. [1]Seems I was wrong about this

It could be. But they're only going to piss off the EU even more with these moves. Right now Apple is probably winning a battle but might be losing the war. The next big EU mandate, besides tackling climate change, will probably be clamping down on tax shenanigans. Next time they won't even be able to win anything as the law will be explicitly against such corporate maneuvers.

stormdennis 6y ago
The commission isn't all powerful. There are different national interests in Europe and all countries have a veto on such matters I believe
- matthewheath 6y ago
  > all countries have a veto on such matters I believe In most cases, a veto can't happen unless the following conditions are met: 1) Less than 55% of total Member States (less than 15) voting AND 2) The voting Member States represent less than 65% of the total EU population AND (assuming at least one of the conditions above aren't met) 3) At least four countries vote to block the measure OR (if not all countries are voting) 4) The minimum number of countries that represent more than 35% of the total EU population, plus one country, vote to block the measure. This prevents e.g. 3 big countries from blocking the others.
  - stormdennis 6y ago
    The rules you quote do not apply to matters of taxation, I believe which is a power reserved to national governments.
marcyb5st 6y ago
Are you sure? I think that countries that benefit from such schemes (e.g. Ireland, Netherlands, Luxembourg) can veto, sink such proposals before they land, or simply partially comply. For instance, the Netherlands announced a withholding tax on royalties for 2021 "for cases where abuse is involved" [1] after international pressure. The way I read this is that they are building a facade where it looks they are complying with other EU regulations, but in reality it's business as usual. This way other EU countries have no appeal to these schemes as the Netherlands can say "we looked into these allegations, but no abuse there" and do nothing. [1] https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Documents/Tax/dttl-tax-netherlandshighlights-2019.pdf https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Docume...
- oblio 6y ago
  There are countries that benefit from it, and they can veto. However, the reality is... realpolitik still exists. If Germany and France decide things should really change, what negotiating power do you think the Netherlands or Luxembourg or Ireland really have? For example the Dutch economy is basically hitched to the German one, Germany can find a lot of creative ways to inflict a lot of pain on the Netherlands if it really wants to ;-)
  - alphadevx 6y ago
    Let me introduce you to the New Hanseatic League, you will be surprised what an aligned group of small countries within the EU can achieve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Hanseatic_League https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Hanseatic_League
  - stormdennis 6y ago
    Alliances vary according to the issue. Germany and France are often at loggerheads. France has a particular beef with with Ireland's 12% corporation tax rate but agrees with it on lots of other issues such as agriculture and the measures concerning the pandemic. Ireland passed up on a chance to join the Hanseatic league[1] because in some ways it is not as "Northern European" in outlook as he likes of Finland and the Netherlands. [1]Seems I was wrong about this