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Pretty sure in 2019 if [Chinese company] offered to pay Google a bunch of money for cloud services, Google would take it. Unlike in China, large US corporation

Pretty sure in 2019 if [Chinese company] offered to pay Google a bunch of money for cloud services, Google would take it. Unlike in China, large US corporations don't act as an extension of the government, so China being a rival superpower to the US wouldn't be terribly relevant. Not that the US in general avoids trading with China either.

justicezyx 6y ago
What are you talking about? I am saying TikTok has to base its engineering entirely in US soil, given its prospect to become main stream.
- throwaway1997 6y ago
  Tiktok is just a rebranded version of the app called 抖音 (Douyin). It's made in China
  - poiuytrewqa 6y ago
    True, but while tiktok is international and serve the content from servers not located in China. The Chinese version is different both in terms of content (you won't find the same "influencer") and in term of setup (servers in China with further settings to comply to stricter Chinese regulations)
- 0xEFF 6y ago
  TikTok is already mainstream.
wonnage 6y ago
Huawei (a Chinese company) was paying Google a bunch of money in 2019 until they were banned by the government. You may argue that this was justified for national security reasons, but the decision was ultimately up to the whims of the president, and not subject to any sort of actual process or oversight by elected officials.
- frequentnapper 6y ago
  Trump, like it or not, is an elected official and I doubt he understands very much about tech to make that decision on his own.
  - samplatt 6y ago
    "Elected official" is such a funny term, these days. It CAN mean a legitimate installation of a decision-maker based on decisions (votes) of their peers, but in the case of Saruman the Orange, it can also mean the (unfortunately) technically-legitimate theft of power by hostile forces.
- lern_too_spel 6y ago
  What was Huawei paying Google for? If anything, Google was paying Huawei to be the default search engine on its phones outside of China.
tehjoker 6y ago
The US government and corporations are basically one and the same. The USG will extend deals that favor corporations. China is an "enemy" to the extent that it will harm the profitability and flexibility of US corporations or the military empire that supports US market dominance. To think that a country half a world away would factor into calculations in any other way is a misunderstanding of great power politics. There is no military threat to anything a normal person would consider domestic interests.
- rpdillon 6y ago
  > The US government and corporations are basically one and the same. Not really. Corporations and the government fight about all kinds of stuff, like encryption, and handing over private information about their users. Companies try to buy influence through lobbying, sure, but that's a far cry from 'basically one and the same'.
  - tehjoker 6y ago
    This is a mere tactical disagreement. The government and the security state are extensively intertwined to an extent that the place where one begins and the other ends is hard to distangle given the revolving door of employees and defense contracts. The extent to which the buisness community as a whole has the ear of the government vs the people is evident given the extremely large disagreements between public opinion polls and implemented policy. If corporations want something, they don't always get it, but if the people want something and corps disagree the people almost never get it. Study: Gilens and Page. "Testing Theories of American Politics: Elites, Interest Groups, and Average Citizens". American Political Science Association. 2014. pgs. 564-581. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-poli... BBC Article about it: "Study: US is an oligarchy, not a democracy" https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746 https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746
    - poiuytrewqa 6y ago
Thorrez 6y ago
justicezyx isn't saying Google would turn down a Chinese company's business. justicezyx is saying a Chinese company cannot become popular among US consumers. I don't exactly agree with that argument, but we should at least understand what the argument is.
- tempestn 6y ago
  I gather that from their later replies. I imagine you can see why I interpreted the statement that way in the first place though.
rorykoehler 6y ago
> large US corporations don't act as an extension of the government Have you read this? https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/ https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/
- KorematsuFred 6y ago
  Yes, but we are discussing "compared to" scenario here.
  - rorykoehler 6y ago
    I agree Chinese companies are basically branches of government if that's what you are saying however I also think the relationship between corporate USA and the federal government is a lot closer than most people realise.
    - ethbro 6y ago
      "A lot closer than most people realise" != the same.

justicezyx 6y ago

What are you talking about? I am saying TikTok has to base its engineering entirely in US soil, given its prospect to become main stream.

throwaway1997 6y ago
Tiktok is just a rebranded version of the app called 抖音 (Douyin). It's made in China
- poiuytrewqa 6y ago
  True, but while tiktok is international and serve the content from servers not located in China. The Chinese version is different both in terms of content (you won't find the same "influencer") and in term of setup (servers in China with further settings to comply to stricter Chinese regulations)
0xEFF 6y ago
TikTok is already mainstream.

wonnage 6y ago

Huawei (a Chinese company) was paying Google a bunch of money in 2019 until they were banned by the government. You may argue that this was justified for national security reasons, but the decision was ultimately up to the whims of the president, and not subject to any sort of actual process or oversight by elected officials.

frequentnapper 6y ago
Trump, like it or not, is an elected official and I doubt he understands very much about tech to make that decision on his own.
- samplatt 6y ago
  "Elected official" is such a funny term, these days. It CAN mean a legitimate installation of a decision-maker based on decisions (votes) of their peers, but in the case of Saruman the Orange, it can also mean the (unfortunately) technically-legitimate theft of power by hostile forces.
lern_too_spel 6y ago
What was Huawei paying Google for? If anything, Google was paying Huawei to be the default search engine on its phones outside of China.

tehjoker 6y ago

The US government and corporations are basically one and the same. The USG will extend deals that favor corporations. China is an "enemy" to the extent that it will harm the profitability and flexibility of US corporations or the military empire that supports US market dominance. To think that a country half a world away would factor into calculations in any other way is a misunderstanding of great power politics. There is no military threat to anything a normal person would consider domestic interests.

rpdillon 6y ago
> The US government and corporations are basically one and the same. Not really. Corporations and the government fight about all kinds of stuff, like encryption, and handing over private information about their users. Companies try to buy influence through lobbying, sure, but that's a far cry from 'basically one and the same'.
- tehjoker 6y ago
  This is a mere tactical disagreement. The government and the security state are extensively intertwined to an extent that the place where one begins and the other ends is hard to distangle given the revolving door of employees and defense contracts. The extent to which the buisness community as a whole has the ear of the government vs the people is evident given the extremely large disagreements between public opinion polls and implemented policy. If corporations want something, they don't always get it, but if the people want something and corps disagree the people almost never get it. Study: Gilens and Page. "Testing Theories of American Politics: Elites, Interest Groups, and Average Citizens". American Political Science Association. 2014. pgs. 564-581. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-poli... BBC Article about it: "Study: US is an oligarchy, not a democracy" https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746 https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746
  - poiuytrewqa 6y ago

Thorrez 6y ago

justicezyx isn't saying Google would turn down a Chinese company's business. justicezyx is saying a Chinese company cannot become popular among US consumers. I don't exactly agree with that argument, but we should at least understand what the argument is.

tempestn 6y ago
I gather that from their later replies. I imagine you can see why I interpreted the statement that way in the first place though.

rorykoehler 6y ago

> large US corporations don't act as an extension of the government Have you read this? https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/ https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/

KorematsuFred 6y ago
Yes, but we are discussing "compared to" scenario here.
- rorykoehler 6y ago
  I agree Chinese companies are basically branches of government if that's what you are saying however I also think the relationship between corporate USA and the federal government is a lot closer than most people realise.
  - ethbro 6y ago
    "A lot closer than most people realise" != the same.