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What if 'advancements' were anything but? How would we know whether we're advancing a nascent engineering discipline in the best way possible? Is public cloud,

by bfb09 6y ago

What if 'advancements' were anything but? How would we know whether we're advancing a nascent engineering discipline in the best way possible? Is public cloud, an optimization for a certain calculus of engineering resources, the optimal form of computing delivery? There's an underlying presumption about computing progress that has weaseled its way into your thinking, and the devil of it is that there are vanishingly few people willing to question it (can hardly blame them, given this thread).

freshhawk 6y ago
You seem unfamiliar with the mystical energy force that always ensures the direction of "progress" is always positive for everyone. It's very un-techy to not believe in this, you need to immediately forget enough social science subjects so you can get back to the purity of ignorance.
- 0xdeadbeefbabe 6y ago
  That demo from 1968 ruins everything (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY), like the illusion of progress.
- bfb09 6y ago
  You jest, but there is an actual argument somewhere in this dumpster fire arguing that philosophy cannot explain the overall direction of technology, as evidenced by a particular software's choice of license and the underlying assumption that technology is "different" from any other human endeavor. Nebulous philosophical arguments do explain things. Quite readily, actually.
- castillar76 6y ago
  James Mickens' 'Technological Manifest Destiny', cited at UseNIX 2018, is a real thing. At the time, listening to it, it was easy to chuckle, but I've since had a lot of sobering conversations with people in which I realized partway through that they really believed these things, and that's frightening. Technological Manifest Destiny: 1. Technology is value neutral and will therefore automatically lead to great outcomes for everyone. 2. If we delay the rollout of new technology than we would delay the distribution of the inevitably great impacts for everyone. 3. History is generally uninteresting because the past has nothing to teach us right now. (https://www.zachpfeffer.com/single-post/2018/11/27/Transcript-of-James-Mickens-USENIX-Speech https://www.zachpfeffer.com/single-post/2018/11/27/Transcrip..., ca. 37 minutes in)

by bfb09 6y ago

freshhawk 6y ago

You seem unfamiliar with the mystical energy force that always ensures the direction of "progress" is always positive for everyone. It's very un-techy to not believe in this, you need to immediately forget enough social science subjects so you can get back to the purity of ignorance.

0xdeadbeefbabe 6y ago
That demo from 1968 ruins everything (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY), like the illusion of progress.
bfb09 6y ago
You jest, but there is an actual argument somewhere in this dumpster fire arguing that philosophy cannot explain the overall direction of technology, as evidenced by a particular software's choice of license and the underlying assumption that technology is "different" from any other human endeavor. Nebulous philosophical arguments do explain things. Quite readily, actually.
castillar76 6y ago
James Mickens' 'Technological Manifest Destiny', cited at UseNIX 2018, is a real thing. At the time, listening to it, it was easy to chuckle, but I've since had a lot of sobering conversations with people in which I realized partway through that they really believed these things, and that's frightening. Technological Manifest Destiny: 1. Technology is value neutral and will therefore automatically lead to great outcomes for everyone. 2. If we delay the rollout of new technology than we would delay the distribution of the inevitably great impacts for everyone. 3. History is generally uninteresting because the past has nothing to teach us right now. (https://www.zachpfeffer.com/single-post/2018/11/27/Transcript-of-James-Mickens-USENIX-Speech https://www.zachpfeffer.com/single-post/2018/11/27/Transcrip..., ca. 37 minutes in)