5 ms·

I just want to live in an egalitarian society with good public transit. No poverty, no hunger, I want larger community groups outside of just the nuclear family

I just want to live in an egalitarian society with good public transit. No poverty, no hunger, I want larger community groups outside of just the nuclear family. A society where people can afford to work their dream job, even if it doesn't pay top dollar. I want to contribute towards a society that cares for all people.

jelliclesfarm 6y ago
The problem with egalitarian societies is that there will be no progress. Progress necessarily insists upon societal hierarchy. Faustian bargain. What would you choose?
- GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
  You've presented a false dichotomy, and I'd love a citation on your first point. Anyways, I'd argue that hierarchy is incredibly inefficient. For example, does every child who aspires to be a scientist get to go to college and pursue that passion? Obviously the US doesn't have free education for every person, it's highly gated by wealth.
  - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
    Ok. Example: Food gatherers in Melenesia. They have no ruling authority and are considered egalitarian according to given anthropological definition. In the animal kingdom, elephants and lionesses(not lions) are egalitarian. Egalitarianism can only exist if the society is already at the top of the food chain. Size matters.(the females also have smaller litters) Resources must be easily available and they don’t have fight over it. Lionesses have lions maintaining the hierarchy. The opposite of egalitarianism in animal society is that of hyenas. They have a caste system like hierarchy. They are scavengers. Their litters are larger than say..big cats or pachyderms. Resource denied and have to scheme rather than cooperate(another egalitarian necessity) Egalitarianism is only possible when there is no competition for resources or scarcity of resources, no threats and a small elite population. If I were to hazard a guess: They can also be found in matriarchal societies with a warrior male populace. War like societies/tribes/groups face higher mortality and cooperation amongst females is crucial to propagate their species/race/gene pool.
    - GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
      This is a hilariously reductive viewpoint. I would strongly urge you to pick up a sociology / anthropology text book. We aren't animals anymore.
      - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
        I am disappointed that in HN, posters don’t debate or discuss points anymore, but rather pass judgements and opinions on posters. This is bringing down the quality of discussion and frankly of HN itself. So you have nothing to say. Ok. Got it. Fine. Have a nice day. I will read what I want when I want in my own sweet time.
        GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
        You engaged my point, provided meaningless allegory with the "animal kingdom", and then complain when I asked for more information or explanation. "Debating" or "discussing" usually requires a _bit_ more effort on your behalf.
        jelliclesfarm 6y ago
        Yes. You have made your point. Thank you. Please drive through.

jelliclesfarm 6y ago

The problem with egalitarian societies is that there will be no progress. Progress necessarily insists upon societal hierarchy. Faustian bargain. What would you choose?

GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
You've presented a false dichotomy, and I'd love a citation on your first point. Anyways, I'd argue that hierarchy is incredibly inefficient. For example, does every child who aspires to be a scientist get to go to college and pursue that passion? Obviously the US doesn't have free education for every person, it's highly gated by wealth.
- jelliclesfarm 6y ago
  Ok. Example: Food gatherers in Melenesia. They have no ruling authority and are considered egalitarian according to given anthropological definition. In the animal kingdom, elephants and lionesses(not lions) are egalitarian. Egalitarianism can only exist if the society is already at the top of the food chain. Size matters.(the females also have smaller litters) Resources must be easily available and they don’t have fight over it. Lionesses have lions maintaining the hierarchy. The opposite of egalitarianism in animal society is that of hyenas. They have a caste system like hierarchy. They are scavengers. Their litters are larger than say..big cats or pachyderms. Resource denied and have to scheme rather than cooperate(another egalitarian necessity) Egalitarianism is only possible when there is no competition for resources or scarcity of resources, no threats and a small elite population. If I were to hazard a guess: They can also be found in matriarchal societies with a warrior male populace. War like societies/tribes/groups face higher mortality and cooperation amongst females is crucial to propagate their species/race/gene pool.
  - GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
    This is a hilariously reductive viewpoint. I would strongly urge you to pick up a sociology / anthropology text book. We aren't animals anymore.
    - jelliclesfarm 6y ago
      I am disappointed that in HN, posters don’t debate or discuss points anymore, but rather pass judgements and opinions on posters. This is bringing down the quality of discussion and frankly of HN itself. So you have nothing to say. Ok. Got it. Fine. Have a nice day. I will read what I want when I want in my own sweet time.
      - GaryNumanVevo 6y ago
        You engaged my point, provided meaningless allegory with the "animal kingdom", and then complain when I asked for more information or explanation. "Debating" or "discussing" usually requires a _bit_ more effort on your behalf.
        jelliclesfarm 6y ago
        Yes. You have made your point. Thank you. Please drive through.