4 ms·

> For the record: put me in the "police are needed to deter obvious crime and violence" camp AND the "we do WAY too much policing of things other than immediate

> For the record: put me in the "police are needed to deter obvious crime and violence" camp AND the "we do WAY too much policing of things other than immediate criminal behavior" group. How's that for failed? Well then you wouldn't fall into any political ideology I was being critical of. Both your views are moderated by some common sense. Abolishing the police force is not a moderate view (and yet is what is being called for).

newacct583 6y ago
Almost no one who shouts "defund the police" literally means they want no law enforcement. That is absolutely not "what is being called for" in any meaningful sense. And if you bothered to look for a mission statement or explanation from these people from any source but conservative media, you would know that.
- Thorentis 6y ago
  > from any source but conservative media I didn't realise that wanting a police force automatically made you a conservative? Wasn't your main point that the left still want law enforcement?
- neonate 6y ago
  That's untrue, there is an active debate about it on the left, and the people who originated the idea insist that abolition is exactly what they meant and still mean. https://twitter.com/jduffyrice/status/1270380991178321921 https://twitter.com/jduffyrice/status/1270380991178321921 https://www.mpd150.com/what-are-we-talking-about-when-we-talk-about-a-police-free-future/ https://www.mpd150.com/what-are-we-talking-about-when-we-tal...
  - newacct583 6y ago
    Link me one significant policymaker, pundit, protest movement head or thought leader who "insists" on "abolition". Hell, I'll even take a name brand blogger. People say crazy shit somewhere, I'm sure. But even the Chapo folks aren't calling for this in the way you mean.
    - neonate 6y ago
      By the way, I'm not trying to put the idea down. I think police abolition is an interesting proposal and a lot of work and thought has been put into it. It erases those thinkers when we say "they don't really mean it" and bundle them in with much weaker proposals. They do really mean it, and the debate is important.
    - neonate 6y ago
      Sorry, I edited my comment to add links before I saw your reply.

newacct583 6y ago

Almost no one who shouts "defund the police" literally means they want no law enforcement. That is absolutely not "what is being called for" in any meaningful sense. And if you bothered to look for a mission statement or explanation from these people from any source but conservative media, you would know that.

Thorentis 6y ago
> from any source but conservative media I didn't realise that wanting a police force automatically made you a conservative? Wasn't your main point that the left still want law enforcement?
neonate 6y ago
That's untrue, there is an active debate about it on the left, and the people who originated the idea insist that abolition is exactly what they meant and still mean. https://twitter.com/jduffyrice/status/1270380991178321921 https://twitter.com/jduffyrice/status/1270380991178321921 https://www.mpd150.com/what-are-we-talking-about-when-we-talk-about-a-police-free-future/ https://www.mpd150.com/what-are-we-talking-about-when-we-tal...
- newacct583 6y ago
  Link me one significant policymaker, pundit, protest movement head or thought leader who "insists" on "abolition". Hell, I'll even take a name brand blogger. People say crazy shit somewhere, I'm sure. But even the Chapo folks aren't calling for this in the way you mean.
  - neonate 6y ago
    By the way, I'm not trying to put the idea down. I think police abolition is an interesting proposal and a lot of work and thought has been put into it. It erases those thinkers when we say "they don't really mean it" and bundle them in with much weaker proposals. They do really mean it, and the debate is important.
  - neonate 6y ago
    Sorry, I edited my comment to add links before I saw your reply.