4 ms·

That's a rather fallacious argument. 6.9bn people never existing != killing 6.9bn people. And the hosting of those 7bn people has caused irreperable damage to

by el_oni 6y ago

That's a rather fallacious argument. 6.9bn people never existing != killing 6.9bn people. And the hosting of those 7bn people has caused irreperable damage to ecosystems. Why are you so happy for the extinction of entire species, but not for 6.9bn people not existing?

quotemstr 6y ago
> Why are you so happy for the extinction of entire species, but not for 6.9bn people not existing? Why should I care about "entire species"? I'm happy that we made smallpox extinct. Likewise, I'd be ecstatic if we decided to drive the mosquito out of existence. I'm all for caring about nature, but towards the end of improving human welfare. Where saving some random species conflicts with saving people, choosing anything but the latter is just monstrous. Sentient creatures (only humans, currently) have moral worth. Non-sentient creatures, none.
- el_oni 6y ago
  Thats such a selfish outlook. The same outlook that leads to overfishing, soil erosion and monoculture agricuture. We think we are optimising for human welfare and happiness whilst simultaneously destroying our ability to give future generations the same prospects that we have. So why are you happy for the untold billions who will never be born because we've ruined out planets ability to sustain us? Sustainability is about being able to give future generations the same quality of life that you have had. And society as it stands is not sustainable
ekianjo 6y ago
In case you are unaware we were losing babies by the truckload just a century ago. There was death, but we all forgot since we dont see it anymore.
- el_oni 6y ago
  I am aware. And that is progress that is good for humanity. However air quality is decreasing and global temperatures are increasing. A century from now we'll be losing a truckload more babies Its like we rose to the top of the bell curve and are now hurtling down the other side
  - hef19898 6y ago
    Where exactly is air quality decreasing? At least in developed nation air quality, and water quality, improved over the last decades. Climate Change is another topic but there seems to be some movement as well on that front.

by el_oni 6y ago

quotemstr 6y ago

> Why are you so happy for the extinction of entire species, but not for 6.9bn people not existing? Why should I care about "entire species"? I'm happy that we made smallpox extinct. Likewise, I'd be ecstatic if we decided to drive the mosquito out of existence. I'm all for caring about nature, but towards the end of improving human welfare. Where saving some random species conflicts with saving people, choosing anything but the latter is just monstrous. Sentient creatures (only humans, currently) have moral worth. Non-sentient creatures, none.

el_oni 6y ago
Thats such a selfish outlook. The same outlook that leads to overfishing, soil erosion and monoculture agricuture. We think we are optimising for human welfare and happiness whilst simultaneously destroying our ability to give future generations the same prospects that we have. So why are you happy for the untold billions who will never be born because we've ruined out planets ability to sustain us? Sustainability is about being able to give future generations the same quality of life that you have had. And society as it stands is not sustainable

ekianjo 6y ago

In case you are unaware we were losing babies by the truckload just a century ago. There was death, but we all forgot since we dont see it anymore.

el_oni 6y ago
I am aware. And that is progress that is good for humanity. However air quality is decreasing and global temperatures are increasing. A century from now we'll be losing a truckload more babies Its like we rose to the top of the bell curve and are now hurtling down the other side
- hef19898 6y ago
  Where exactly is air quality decreasing? At least in developed nation air quality, and water quality, improved over the last decades. Climate Change is another topic but there seems to be some movement as well on that front.