8 ms·

The First American Restaurants’ Culinary Concoctions

22 points by samclemens 6y ago

soared 6y ago
Interesting that they are so many birds, when I only ever eat chicken, turkey, and very very rarely duck. Not to mention turtle/etc! Also curious that beaver wasn’t mentioned, I’d imagine that to be a delicacy.
simonsarris 6y ago
I love looking at old menus. The New York Public Library actually has a collection of 17,000 scans of them, organized by decade, going back to the 1850's: http://menus.nypl.org/menus http://menus.nypl.org/menus And all of the offerings broken down into dishes, also by decade: http://menus.nypl.org/dishes/decade/all http://menus.nypl.org/dishes/decade/all It even has things like airline menus from the 1980's, TAP: http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/53824/explore http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/53824/explore The Menu of Air France's Concorde: http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/44451 http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/44451 (If you like this sort of thing I try to maintain a list of high quality art collections and archival finds, here: https://simonsarris.com/art-collections https://simonsarris.com/art-collections Please let me know if you know of any great resources that should be on the list that I don't have.)
tpmx 6y ago
> For one thing, it was fashionable for European visitors to complain about American food. Famous visitors like Frances Trollope groused that it was “abundant but not delicate” in 1832. Ten years later, Charles Dickens’s first trip to America was “a culinary disaster.” Feels familiar...
- Melting_Harps 6y ago
  > Feels familiar... Sadly, very much so as a person who has actually been in the Industry on both Continents. My old teammate and I went to a renown Chef's place near a skiing village to seek other prospects for him and he ordered one of the daily specials for the table, Linguini and clams, what we had was in his words 'like the packaged Lipton noodles.' Italian is my repertoire, so while I didn't speak my face said it all and we abruptly ended the meal then and there and they chose to drink instead. I couldn't even enjoy the house spirits, which they made on site at the distillery, as it was incredibly bitter and I just slid it to my friend. Hours earlier we were eating local, seasonal stone-fruit and some so-so grocery store tier charcuterie paired with wine from Rioja I had brought for an aperativo, that quite honestly was 1/5 the price of the bill but overall way more balanced and satisfying then anything I had in that restaurant. It's sad, because I know that restaurants are really hurting right now as a whole, and some of the stories really cut deep, but I'd argue that had nothing changed the US culinary World would eventually just be indistinguishable from the Commercial crap that litters Attractions like DisneyLand and such and caters to the lowest common denominator. Commercialization and commodification is almost like a Religion in the US and that expands to its food/diet with horrible consequences (diabetes/heart disease); whereas in much of the rest of the World, Food has much more significance and reverence than Religion as an institution ever had: I've eaten Sunday Ragu at the Nona's house, covered in Catholic Art and crucifixes, with a devout Atheist in Italy who would bow his head before eating just to be able to enjoy the amazing 2-3 hour dining experience! I mean the idea of re-inventing the grilled cheese, or Bao with friend chicken or having sprinkle-laden sweets is quite honestly pathetic given how rich the Ag culture is in certain places of the US. Not to mention all of the European, Asian, African and Central/South American diaspora that happened. To this day my favorite spots to eat are usually tiny, mom/pop Asian spots like pho places, or Thai restaurants with limited menu offerings. They do something they know and love, and do it well. No glitz, no glamour, no celebrity chef: just amazing food. And when you tip them 50-100% of the bill their faces still light up. > Americans were also renowned for eating with great speed: Delmonico’s scheduled an average of eight to ten minutes per course for their fourteen-course meal. Dinner was served from 2 p.m. to 5 p.m. Food could still be had later in the evening, but choices were more limited. This is also something I think really irks me about US (food) culture in general; I never accepted any job offer that didn't allow me to have a 1 hour lunch after my horrible experience when I worked in a Lab. And while this haste model makes sense for things like Ramen, something I only have a luke-warm relationship with, it's not something I would ever consider a desirable attribute in a Culture, and one of the reasons I never felt truly at home in the US. The notion of rushing what is often the most social, a pleasurable period of my day (Dinner) is unfathomable to me. Being at the table for 2-4 hours is not an exception, it's a norm when I dine with family and friends.
  - phonypc 6y ago
    I think they were commenting on the fact that it's still fashionable to look down on American food as uncultured. Case in point, your post.
    - Melting_Harps 6y ago
      It doesn't have to be, is my point. I've done 'New American' at a Farm to Table and we did 20k+ nights 4-5 day days of the week during the peak season.
      - phonypc 6y ago
        It isn't in general, and never was, is my point. Merely fashionable to think of it as so. My local McDonald's probably does 20k+ days all week too. What of it?
        Melting_Harps 6y ago
        > It isn't in general, and never was, is my point. Merely fashionable to think of it as so. I disagree, and many chefs in the US have been trying to make significant inroads to that end: some more than others of course. Fashionable, well, that's the to be expected its called Culinary Art for a reason, and the whims of fashion are inevitable: if you go back to what was regarded as gastronomical Haute couture in the 80s it looks pre-historically antiquated and drab in comparison to something coming from someone like Ferran Adria, or René Redzepi from the last decade. But just focusing on the synopsis of what was found in those menus in the US, I'd argue those menu's of the past are far more sophisticated then they are now and would be an improvement to revert to in just about every way: > Freedman’s appendix lists 928 entrees served at New York’s Fifth Avenue Hotel between 1859 and 1865. Nine variations on calf’s head. Fillet of beef and fish, but also chicken, duck, goose, green turtle, grouse, lamb, mutton, pigeon, pork, veal, and venison. Almost all of those meats could also be found hashed. Fried eel and six variations of frog, including “fried English style.” If you hungered for lamb fries (which are testicles), there were at least five ways they could be prepared. Many wild birds were on the menu, including plover with Champagne sauce, snipe in cases, and rice birds with toast. For the nose-to-tail crowd, there were thirteen different tripe preparations. > My local McDonald's probably does 20k+ days all week too. What of it? Many things, not least of which is that its upholding to the standards of a more sustainable and nourishing business model, but also proving that doing things the right way, that is eating local, seasonally and organic can also be profitable. It's incredibly hard work running for 8.5 months like that with 60+ hour work weeks and only one day off to recover, I had ran kitchens before but that level of volume was not something I had ever encountered until my last role where I had over 60% of the menu on the busiest station in the restaurant, but my aforementioned teammate, who worked saute, actually did 21 day runs at one point when we were losing everyone. But looking back at it the reward is pretty significant, especially now that the Industry is literately in shambles and may never fully recover or go back to what it was. Which for some of us is ultimately a good thing. If you have time to actually look into what this Industry is, as I doubt you have or will ever work in it given what you've said thus far, check out David Chang's Too Small to Fail podcasts [1] where both David Chang and Chris Ying interview some Restauranteurs/Chefs who have dared to defy the odds and try to make those 'inroads' on their own own dime. The episode with Ann Kim, a Korean immigrant chef who's family migrated to Minneapolis, spoke about the recent riots was f'ing heart heart-breaking and emotive. I never wanted to launch my own restaurant, I had enough sadistic ventures being a boot-strapping fintech Founder for one Lifetime, but I could totally empathize with her story and plight. 1: https://open.spotify.com/show/0y4DksD5a6sJvcVR6okX5r?go=1&utm_source=embed_v3&t=0&nd=1 https://open.spotify.com/show/0y4DksD5a6sJvcVR6okX5r?go=1&ut...
miohtama 6y ago
Interesting is that dinner was 2pm to 5pm. When I was a kid in Nordics, the school lunch was 10:30 and dinner usually 17:30 when both parents were home from the work. As far as I have seen most Western countries follow a later schedule.
- asciimike 6y ago
  I assume this is due to the subtle semantic differences between "dinner" and "supper", particularly in the 1800s and early 1900s (up to about WWII). "Dinner" at that time referred to the mid-day meal (often the largest meal of the day: laborers needed the food to get through the rest of the day, it's hard to have a big meal without good lighting), while "supper" is the evening meal. Source/anecdata: my grandfather, who, born in 1916, referred to "dinner" as "supper" until his death in 2018.
  - war1025 6y ago
    Here in Iowa, the evening meal is almost universally called supper. The noon meal is called lunch. Dinner is mostly a less-used alternate for supper. I can't remember anyone ever calling lunch "dinner".
gautamdivgi 6y ago
Wonder how their supply chain worked for all that variety back then. Without reliable refrigeration I'm curious to see how food was preserved.
- pantaloony 6y ago
  - less exotic stuff available—many ingredients had to be sourced locally. - Underground storage. - Lots and lots of canning. Like... lots of it. - preserved meat and cheese as a necessity rather than a choice - Actual ice for refrigeration. As in, giant chunks of ice shipped in(!) and used in ice-boxes.
- Melting_Harps 6y ago
  > Wonder how their supply chain worked for all that variety back then. Without reliable refrigeration I'm curious to see how food was preserved. Laboriously, but perhaps far more superior to much of today's 'on-demnad' delivery method as we know it in terms of quality. I have a passion for both Culinary and Supply Chains, and to be honest, the Restaurant Industry was one where I gave it a pass for not being fully optimized and automated as much as possible. When I was in Europe I really enjoyed seeing and visiting the restaurants we supplied to when I was a farming apprentice, I'd come through the back of the Kitchen and see and smell a lot of the produce we made on the farm be used in the recipes it was intoxicating and usually the highlight of my day. And then we spoke with the Chef de cuisine or Exec Chef as he looked at what we had to offer and his head was in going 100 MPH thinking what he could do for daily specials and he'd pick what he wanted before we went to the Farmer's markets. That experience is what got me out of retirement as a chef and I forgot how much I enjoyed the entire experience, and what it could be (Farm to table in the US was very limited, but rather common in the part of Europe I was in) and I decided to run Kitchens while I underwent my Ag Apprenticeship, which meant working 70+ hour weeks. The same thing happened when I came out of retirement for the 3rd and last time as a cook, this time in the US and solely focused on Farm to Table concepts in Boulder. I did stage and work in Micheline, and James Beard places but I never lasted as the passion wasn't there as I never got to see or interact with the Farmers or much of their products, which to me is the primary reason why I even bothered to get back in to an Industry I honestly otherwise despise. I imagine it was like much of the Bistros, Cafes, and Izakaya in Europe and Japan that entailed being around Food Distribution Hubs/Marketplaces, waking up your apprentices really early to shop for the day's service, and going to Farmer's Markets/Green Market's for the rest and buying everything that was in season (read: cheap and plentiful). I can't speak of the US culinary history outside of places like California, because while I was introduced to the Industry in the US it was run by a French baker and she operated the catering business we were in with a brigade system, In Europe I ran agro-tourism Kitchens and replicated the model with a smaller staff and filled the gaps where needed, and on top of being the Sous/Chef I was also the Farm Manager so I sourced upwards of 85% of the ingredients on the Menu on farm, things like Wine, deserts and some liquors making up the other part. When I cam back to the US I mainly focused on Farm to table models, and they are not the most optimal in terms of delivering costs: our Oysters were over-nighted from a Diver we had in the E. Coast. Our Beef, Pork and Chickens were from local farms that did batch shipping for us multiple times a week, and would send their farm workers during peak season if we needed more proteins. Much of our seasonal veg came from local farms, we only used Suppliers for things like seafood, condiments, spices and non-seasonal veg on a regular basis and had to put in orders on a semi-daily basis. But because the volume and cost/dish were optimized in such a way that we had very good ROI and good food costs (benefits of knowing your farmers) we could carry the costs of a sub-optimized supply chain. Look up Eugénie Brazier, her story took place around that time in Lyon, France. Bourdain did some stuff on his shows highlighting her work when he did episodes that included Paul Bocuse and mentioned the tireless and laborious nature of that model, but that yielded her 6 Micheline stars, for 2 establishments, something that had never been done. But I imagine it had to be the same model in the US, wherein refrigeration was scarce and limited (some places had ice delivery) but it was probably reserved for the expensive proteins for the day. What always interested me was how it was done in fine-dining Cross-Country Coaches/Trains, the amount of tight logistical framework and infrastructure needed for that has to be immense! Probably modeled much like the now seemingly defunct cruise-line ships.
tomcam 6y ago
Prices have gone up roughly 5000% since then (assuming a reasonably high-end restaurant in Manhattan). The menu looks pretty awful. Am a stout USA patriot who does not like most American food at all. I absolutely adore the diversity of modern cuisine.

22 points by samclemens 6y ago

Interesting that they are so many birds, when I only ever eat chicken, turkey, and very very rarely duck. Not to mention turtle/etc! Also curious that beaver wasn’t mentioned, I’d imagine that to be a delicacy.

simonsarris 6y ago

I love looking at old menus. The New York Public Library actually has a collection of 17,000 scans of them, organized by decade, going back to the 1850's: http://menus.nypl.org/menus http://menus.nypl.org/menus And all of the offerings broken down into dishes, also by decade: http://menus.nypl.org/dishes/decade/all http://menus.nypl.org/dishes/decade/all It even has things like airline menus from the 1980's, TAP: http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/53824/explore http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/53824/explore The Menu of Air France's Concorde: http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/44451 http://menus.nypl.org/menu_pages/44451 (If you like this sort of thing I try to maintain a list of high quality art collections and archival finds, here: https://simonsarris.com/art-collections https://simonsarris.com/art-collections Please let me know if you know of any great resources that should be on the list that I don't have.)

tpmx 6y ago

> For one thing, it was fashionable for European visitors to complain about American food. Famous visitors like Frances Trollope groused that it was “abundant but not delicate” in 1832. Ten years later, Charles Dickens’s first trip to America was “a culinary disaster.” Feels familiar...

Melting_Harps 6y ago
> Feels familiar... Sadly, very much so as a person who has actually been in the Industry on both Continents. My old teammate and I went to a renown Chef's place near a skiing village to seek other prospects for him and he ordered one of the daily specials for the table, Linguini and clams, what we had was in his words 'like the packaged Lipton noodles.' Italian is my repertoire, so while I didn't speak my face said it all and we abruptly ended the meal then and there and they chose to drink instead. I couldn't even enjoy the house spirits, which they made on site at the distillery, as it was incredibly bitter and I just slid it to my friend. Hours earlier we were eating local, seasonal stone-fruit and some so-so grocery store tier charcuterie paired with wine from Rioja I had brought for an aperativo, that quite honestly was 1/5 the price of the bill but overall way more balanced and satisfying then anything I had in that restaurant. It's sad, because I know that restaurants are really hurting right now as a whole, and some of the stories really cut deep, but I'd argue that had nothing changed the US culinary World would eventually just be indistinguishable from the Commercial crap that litters Attractions like DisneyLand and such and caters to the lowest common denominator. Commercialization and commodification is almost like a Religion in the US and that expands to its food/diet with horrible consequences (diabetes/heart disease); whereas in much of the rest of the World, Food has much more significance and reverence than Religion as an institution ever had: I've eaten Sunday Ragu at the Nona's house, covered in Catholic Art and crucifixes, with a devout Atheist in Italy who would bow his head before eating just to be able to enjoy the amazing 2-3 hour dining experience! I mean the idea of re-inventing the grilled cheese, or Bao with friend chicken or having sprinkle-laden sweets is quite honestly pathetic given how rich the Ag culture is in certain places of the US. Not to mention all of the European, Asian, African and Central/South American diaspora that happened. To this day my favorite spots to eat are usually tiny, mom/pop Asian spots like pho places, or Thai restaurants with limited menu offerings. They do something they know and love, and do it well. No glitz, no glamour, no celebrity chef: just amazing food. And when you tip them 50-100% of the bill their faces still light up. > Americans were also renowned for eating with great speed: Delmonico’s scheduled an average of eight to ten minutes per course for their fourteen-course meal. Dinner was served from 2 p.m. to 5 p.m. Food could still be had later in the evening, but choices were more limited. This is also something I think really irks me about US (food) culture in general; I never accepted any job offer that didn't allow me to have a 1 hour lunch after my horrible experience when I worked in a Lab. And while this haste model makes sense for things like Ramen, something I only have a luke-warm relationship with, it's not something I would ever consider a desirable attribute in a Culture, and one of the reasons I never felt truly at home in the US. The notion of rushing what is often the most social, a pleasurable period of my day (Dinner) is unfathomable to me. Being at the table for 2-4 hours is not an exception, it's a norm when I dine with family and friends.
- phonypc 6y ago
  I think they were commenting on the fact that it's still fashionable to look down on American food as uncultured. Case in point, your post.
  - Melting_Harps 6y ago
    It doesn't have to be, is my point. I've done 'New American' at a Farm to Table and we did 20k+ nights 4-5 day days of the week during the peak season.
    - phonypc 6y ago
      It isn't in general, and never was, is my point. Merely fashionable to think of it as so. My local McDonald's probably does 20k+ days all week too. What of it?
      - Melting_Harps 6y ago
        > It isn't in general, and never was, is my point. Merely fashionable to think of it as so. I disagree, and many chefs in the US have been trying to make significant inroads to that end: some more than others of course. Fashionable, well, that's the to be expected its called Culinary Art for a reason, and the whims of fashion are inevitable: if you go back to what was regarded as gastronomical Haute couture in the 80s it looks pre-historically antiquated and drab in comparison to something coming from someone like Ferran Adria, or René Redzepi from the last decade. But just focusing on the synopsis of what was found in those menus in the US, I'd argue those menu's of the past are far more sophisticated then they are now and would be an improvement to revert to in just about every way: > Freedman’s appendix lists 928 entrees served at New York’s Fifth Avenue Hotel between 1859 and 1865. Nine variations on calf’s head. Fillet of beef and fish, but also chicken, duck, goose, green turtle, grouse, lamb, mutton, pigeon, pork, veal, and venison. Almost all of those meats could also be found hashed. Fried eel and six variations of frog, including “fried English style.” If you hungered for lamb fries (which are testicles), there were at least five ways they could be prepared. Many wild birds were on the menu, including plover with Champagne sauce, snipe in cases, and rice birds with toast. For the nose-to-tail crowd, there were thirteen different tripe preparations. > My local McDonald's probably does 20k+ days all week too. What of it? Many things, not least of which is that its upholding to the standards of a more sustainable and nourishing business model, but also proving that doing things the right way, that is eating local, seasonally and organic can also be profitable. It's incredibly hard work running for 8.5 months like that with 60+ hour work weeks and only one day off to recover, I had ran kitchens before but that level of volume was not something I had ever encountered until my last role where I had over 60% of the menu on the busiest station in the restaurant, but my aforementioned teammate, who worked saute, actually did 21 day runs at one point when we were losing everyone. But looking back at it the reward is pretty significant, especially now that the Industry is literately in shambles and may never fully recover or go back to what it was. Which for some of us is ultimately a good thing. If you have time to actually look into what this Industry is, as I doubt you have or will ever work in it given what you've said thus far, check out David Chang's Too Small to Fail podcasts [1] where both David Chang and Chris Ying interview some Restauranteurs/Chefs who have dared to defy the odds and try to make those 'inroads' on their own own dime. The episode with Ann Kim, a Korean immigrant chef who's family migrated to Minneapolis, spoke about the recent riots was f'ing heart heart-breaking and emotive. I never wanted to launch my own restaurant, I had enough sadistic ventures being a boot-strapping fintech Founder for one Lifetime, but I could totally empathize with her story and plight. 1: https://open.spotify.com/show/0y4DksD5a6sJvcVR6okX5r?go=1&utm_source=embed_v3&t=0&nd=1 https://open.spotify.com/show/0y4DksD5a6sJvcVR6okX5r?go=1&ut...

miohtama 6y ago

Interesting is that dinner was 2pm to 5pm. When I was a kid in Nordics, the school lunch was 10:30 and dinner usually 17:30 when both parents were home from the work. As far as I have seen most Western countries follow a later schedule.

asciimike 6y ago
I assume this is due to the subtle semantic differences between "dinner" and "supper", particularly in the 1800s and early 1900s (up to about WWII). "Dinner" at that time referred to the mid-day meal (often the largest meal of the day: laborers needed the food to get through the rest of the day, it's hard to have a big meal without good lighting), while "supper" is the evening meal. Source/anecdata: my grandfather, who, born in 1916, referred to "dinner" as "supper" until his death in 2018.
- war1025 6y ago
  Here in Iowa, the evening meal is almost universally called supper. The noon meal is called lunch. Dinner is mostly a less-used alternate for supper. I can't remember anyone ever calling lunch "dinner".

gautamdivgi 6y ago

Wonder how their supply chain worked for all that variety back then. Without reliable refrigeration I'm curious to see how food was preserved.

pantaloony 6y ago
- less exotic stuff available—many ingredients had to be sourced locally. - Underground storage. - Lots and lots of canning. Like... lots of it. - preserved meat and cheese as a necessity rather than a choice - Actual ice for refrigeration. As in, giant chunks of ice shipped in(!) and used in ice-boxes.
Melting_Harps 6y ago
> Wonder how their supply chain worked for all that variety back then. Without reliable refrigeration I'm curious to see how food was preserved. Laboriously, but perhaps far more superior to much of today's 'on-demnad' delivery method as we know it in terms of quality. I have a passion for both Culinary and Supply Chains, and to be honest, the Restaurant Industry was one where I gave it a pass for not being fully optimized and automated as much as possible. When I was in Europe I really enjoyed seeing and visiting the restaurants we supplied to when I was a farming apprentice, I'd come through the back of the Kitchen and see and smell a lot of the produce we made on the farm be used in the recipes it was intoxicating and usually the highlight of my day. And then we spoke with the Chef de cuisine or Exec Chef as he looked at what we had to offer and his head was in going 100 MPH thinking what he could do for daily specials and he'd pick what he wanted before we went to the Farmer's markets. That experience is what got me out of retirement as a chef and I forgot how much I enjoyed the entire experience, and what it could be (Farm to table in the US was very limited, but rather common in the part of Europe I was in) and I decided to run Kitchens while I underwent my Ag Apprenticeship, which meant working 70+ hour weeks. The same thing happened when I came out of retirement for the 3rd and last time as a cook, this time in the US and solely focused on Farm to Table concepts in Boulder. I did stage and work in Micheline, and James Beard places but I never lasted as the passion wasn't there as I never got to see or interact with the Farmers or much of their products, which to me is the primary reason why I even bothered to get back in to an Industry I honestly otherwise despise. I imagine it was like much of the Bistros, Cafes, and Izakaya in Europe and Japan that entailed being around Food Distribution Hubs/Marketplaces, waking up your apprentices really early to shop for the day's service, and going to Farmer's Markets/Green Market's for the rest and buying everything that was in season (read: cheap and plentiful). I can't speak of the US culinary history outside of places like California, because while I was introduced to the Industry in the US it was run by a French baker and she operated the catering business we were in with a brigade system, In Europe I ran agro-tourism Kitchens and replicated the model with a smaller staff and filled the gaps where needed, and on top of being the Sous/Chef I was also the Farm Manager so I sourced upwards of 85% of the ingredients on the Menu on farm, things like Wine, deserts and some liquors making up the other part. When I cam back to the US I mainly focused on Farm to table models, and they are not the most optimal in terms of delivering costs: our Oysters were over-nighted from a Diver we had in the E. Coast. Our Beef, Pork and Chickens were from local farms that did batch shipping for us multiple times a week, and would send their farm workers during peak season if we needed more proteins. Much of our seasonal veg came from local farms, we only used Suppliers for things like seafood, condiments, spices and non-seasonal veg on a regular basis and had to put in orders on a semi-daily basis. But because the volume and cost/dish were optimized in such a way that we had very good ROI and good food costs (benefits of knowing your farmers) we could carry the costs of a sub-optimized supply chain. Look up Eugénie Brazier, her story took place around that time in Lyon, France. Bourdain did some stuff on his shows highlighting her work when he did episodes that included Paul Bocuse and mentioned the tireless and laborious nature of that model, but that yielded her 6 Micheline stars, for 2 establishments, something that had never been done. But I imagine it had to be the same model in the US, wherein refrigeration was scarce and limited (some places had ice delivery) but it was probably reserved for the expensive proteins for the day. What always interested me was how it was done in fine-dining Cross-Country Coaches/Trains, the amount of tight logistical framework and infrastructure needed for that has to be immense! Probably modeled much like the now seemingly defunct cruise-line ships.

tomcam 6y ago

Prices have gone up roughly 5000% since then (assuming a reasonably high-end restaurant in Manhattan). The menu looks pretty awful. Am a stout USA patriot who does not like most American food at all. I absolutely adore the diversity of modern cuisine.