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"A strong union presence is significantly more effective than a minimum wage." Why? To me it seems that governments have far stronger means to enforce a minimu

"A strong union presence is significantly more effective than a minimum wage." Why? To me it seems that governments have far stronger means to enforce a minimum wage than unions have.

DavidVoid 6y ago
But unions have far stronger incentives to push for higher wages than governments do.
- grasshopperpurp 6y ago
  They also get to negotiate their contracts more frequently than the public gets to vote on minimum wage increases - in practice, anyway. The other thing I forgot to mention in my previous post - minimum wage doesn't address benefits and working conditions; though, it could affect those things if high enough (if the wages are high enough everywhere, the other things would have greater impact on where people choose to work). But, unions get to specially argue for things like breaks and better/safer equipment. Certain standards cross industries, and it makes sense to legislate those, but it makes sense for workers within their respective industries to have the ability to ask for accommodations specific to the industry/its conditions. If I were the one paying the workers, I'd rather address their specific wants and concerns than I would the wants and needs of the working population. Of course, they (in general) would rather address neither, and it's easier for them to defeat legislation than collective bargaining.
Lazare 6y ago
A minimum wage is easy to enforce, but that's more of a bug than a feature. Minimum wages have two problems: 1) It's very hard to set it at a correct level. Too low and it does nothing; too high and it causes rampant unemployment. Set it at the right level and you can get some real benefits, but good luck figuring it out, considering that the right level changes from year to year, city to city, and industry to industry. 2) No matter how well you set it, it only impacts the bottom of the labour market. A health labour market (including Northern European style unions) can help set wages intelligently, flexibly, and across all levels of the economy. The fact that unions (unlike the government) cannot just pick a number out of the air and enforce it by fiat is a key element of what makes it work.
- bumby 6y ago
  Can you define what you mean by a healthy labor market? I’ve seen effects of both good and bad unions, but struggle to define clear distinctions other than one appears much more corrupt

"A strong union presence is significantly more effective than a minimum wage." Why? To me it seems that governments have far stronger means to enforce a minimum wage than unions have.

DavidVoid 6y ago

But unions have far stronger incentives to push for higher wages than governments do.

grasshopperpurp 6y ago
They also get to negotiate their contracts more frequently than the public gets to vote on minimum wage increases - in practice, anyway. The other thing I forgot to mention in my previous post - minimum wage doesn't address benefits and working conditions; though, it could affect those things if high enough (if the wages are high enough everywhere, the other things would have greater impact on where people choose to work). But, unions get to specially argue for things like breaks and better/safer equipment. Certain standards cross industries, and it makes sense to legislate those, but it makes sense for workers within their respective industries to have the ability to ask for accommodations specific to the industry/its conditions. If I were the one paying the workers, I'd rather address their specific wants and concerns than I would the wants and needs of the working population. Of course, they (in general) would rather address neither, and it's easier for them to defeat legislation than collective bargaining.

Lazare 6y ago

A minimum wage is easy to enforce, but that's more of a bug than a feature. Minimum wages have two problems: 1) It's very hard to set it at a correct level. Too low and it does nothing; too high and it causes rampant unemployment. Set it at the right level and you can get some real benefits, but good luck figuring it out, considering that the right level changes from year to year, city to city, and industry to industry. 2) No matter how well you set it, it only impacts the bottom of the labour market. A health labour market (including Northern European style unions) can help set wages intelligently, flexibly, and across all levels of the economy. The fact that unions (unlike the government) cannot just pick a number out of the air and enforce it by fiat is a key element of what makes it work.

bumby 6y ago
Can you define what you mean by a healthy labor market? I’ve seen effects of both good and bad unions, but struggle to define clear distinctions other than one appears much more corrupt