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And you're brushing off all the conflict that Native Americans brought to bear against white settlers (do read some accounts of Apache or Comanche raids some ti

And you're brushing off all the conflict that Native Americans brought to bear against white settlers (do read some accounts of Apache or Comanche raids some time), and the concessions given to Native Americans after they were conquered (namely their own sovereign nations and plenty of carveouts to hunting and other laws so they can continue to practice their culture unhindered). They "weren't even given citizenship" because they were considered citizens of their own sovereign nations, not because the US gov't were acting maliciously. For this reason they also weren't required to register for Selective Service to be drafted into WWI (despite this, many non-citizens waived their exemption and registered anyway - maybe they didn't hate the country as much as some might suppose). I don't know what you expect the US gov't to do when attempts at peaceful coexistence between white settlers and the natives tribes failed. Run away as far as the Apache would chase them (to the Atlantic)? No, they went to war as needed, and even allied with other tribes in doing so.

refurb 6y ago
Random comment - I assume your username is an attempt at wit, but even I did a double take Suffice to say it was complicated. I was reading about the tribes that aligned with the Confederacy and the fate of black slaves owned by tribes post-Civil War.
- waffle_ss 6y ago
  My handle dates back to the 90s, when people barely rolled their eyes at a pun in poor taste. It's probably at its apex of hilarity right now, given the sheer number of folks pissing their pants because of a delusion that there are innumerable secret members of a looooong-dead political party hiding under every bed.
  - deleuze 6y ago
    > It's probably at its apex of hilarity right now, given the sheer number of folks pissing their pants because of a delusion that there are innumerable secret members of a looooong-dead political party hiding under every bed. Huh, "wild coincidence" that a user with the name "waffle_ss" spends their time posting about crime statistics and how killing indigenous people is whatever. I'm sure it has nothing to do with your politics.
    - waffle_ss 6y ago
      The Nazis thankfully answered for their crimes. French philosophers have so far escaped punishment, but they have quite a lot to answer for as well.
BeetleB 6y ago
> And you're brushing off all the conflict that Native Americans brought to bear against white settlers Given that you're the first person to bring this up, accusing your parent for "brushing this off" is not coming across as an attempt to have a good faith conversation. > and the concessions given to Native Americans after they were conquered (namely their own sovereign nations and plenty of carveouts to hunting and other laws so they can continue to practice their culture unhindered). The US often didn't honor the terms of these concessions.
- waffle_ss 6y ago
  The parent painted a picture of a one-sided, contemplative genocide when it was far from it. Neither was it a conflict uniquely faced by the United States - read up on the history of Mexico and the Apache for instance. If you want a short biopic version just read about Geronimo's life and what he thought about Mexicans. > The US often didn't honor the terms of these concessions. I agree, not in all cases. But before we could talk reasonably about this we needed to swing the conversation back from the idea that the US gov't was operating a land-stealing, genociding steamroller (and for apparently no reason at all, no less).
  - BeetleB 6y ago
    > The parent painted a picture of a one-sided, contemplative genocide when it was far from it. No he didn't. To put it bluntly, you're reading things that aren't there. We're all welcome to our interpretations of comments, but untentatively asserting your interpretation is a component of "not having a good faith conversation". > Neither was it a conflict uniquely faced by the United States - read up on the history of Mexico and the Apache for instance. And why the need to point this out, when the comment you responded to never suggested otherwise? There is, in fact, implicit acceptance of other genocides in the comment. > But before we could talk reasonably about this we needed to swing the conversation back from the idea that the US gov't was operating a land-stealing, genociding steamroller (and for apparently no reason at all, no less). Who exactly are you talking about here? The comment in question never implied "apparently no reason at all". You're arguing against a nonexistent entity. And the point of my responding to you is to get you back to the reality of the thread, not an imaginary conversation that others here cannot see.
deleuze 6y ago
It's disgusting that this kind of genocidal apologia is acceptable on Hacker News. Unsurprising I guess that a user named "waffle_ss" is a bigot.

refurb 6y ago

Random comment - I assume your username is an attempt at wit, but even I did a double take Suffice to say it was complicated. I was reading about the tribes that aligned with the Confederacy and the fate of black slaves owned by tribes post-Civil War.

waffle_ss 6y ago
My handle dates back to the 90s, when people barely rolled their eyes at a pun in poor taste. It's probably at its apex of hilarity right now, given the sheer number of folks pissing their pants because of a delusion that there are innumerable secret members of a looooong-dead political party hiding under every bed.
- deleuze 6y ago
  > It's probably at its apex of hilarity right now, given the sheer number of folks pissing their pants because of a delusion that there are innumerable secret members of a looooong-dead political party hiding under every bed. Huh, "wild coincidence" that a user with the name "waffle_ss" spends their time posting about crime statistics and how killing indigenous people is whatever. I'm sure it has nothing to do with your politics.
  - waffle_ss 6y ago
    The Nazis thankfully answered for their crimes. French philosophers have so far escaped punishment, but they have quite a lot to answer for as well.

BeetleB 6y ago

> And you're brushing off all the conflict that Native Americans brought to bear against white settlers Given that you're the first person to bring this up, accusing your parent for "brushing this off" is not coming across as an attempt to have a good faith conversation. > and the concessions given to Native Americans after they were conquered (namely their own sovereign nations and plenty of carveouts to hunting and other laws so they can continue to practice their culture unhindered). The US often didn't honor the terms of these concessions.

waffle_ss 6y ago
The parent painted a picture of a one-sided, contemplative genocide when it was far from it. Neither was it a conflict uniquely faced by the United States - read up on the history of Mexico and the Apache for instance. If you want a short biopic version just read about Geronimo's life and what he thought about Mexicans. > The US often didn't honor the terms of these concessions. I agree, not in all cases. But before we could talk reasonably about this we needed to swing the conversation back from the idea that the US gov't was operating a land-stealing, genociding steamroller (and for apparently no reason at all, no less).
- BeetleB 6y ago
  > The parent painted a picture of a one-sided, contemplative genocide when it was far from it. No he didn't. To put it bluntly, you're reading things that aren't there. We're all welcome to our interpretations of comments, but untentatively asserting your interpretation is a component of "not having a good faith conversation". > Neither was it a conflict uniquely faced by the United States - read up on the history of Mexico and the Apache for instance. And why the need to point this out, when the comment you responded to never suggested otherwise? There is, in fact, implicit acceptance of other genocides in the comment. > But before we could talk reasonably about this we needed to swing the conversation back from the idea that the US gov't was operating a land-stealing, genociding steamroller (and for apparently no reason at all, no less). Who exactly are you talking about here? The comment in question never implied "apparently no reason at all". You're arguing against a nonexistent entity. And the point of my responding to you is to get you back to the reality of the thread, not an imaginary conversation that others here cannot see.

deleuze 6y ago

It's disgusting that this kind of genocidal apologia is acceptable on Hacker News. Unsurprising I guess that a user named "waffle_ss" is a bigot.