5 ms·

How is this worth noting at all? Either he's correct or he's not, ad hominem is fallacious. Please engage with ideas on their merits rather than by reading thr

How is this worth noting at all? Either he's correct or he's not, ad hominem is fallacious. Please engage with ideas on their merits rather than by reading through the author's tweets until you eventually find something unfashionable and unrelated.

shadowgovt 6y ago
Because the Big Think was recorded in 2016. It's interesting to see where the Big Thoughts have led him in the intervening 3 years. Engaging ideas on their merits isn't the same as engaging them in a vacuum.
- blub 6y ago
  Where have the big thoughts led him? Maybe you could post that directly instead of some vague innuendo and save us all some wasted time.
  - shadowgovt 6y ago
    It goes to his definition of "political correctness." It seems that what he feels needs to be culturally protected is his right to make unfunny, inaccurate claims about the nature of London without criticism. While (to my knowledge) nobody says he shouldn't have the right to make such claims, the notion that he's heading towards an "Orwellian nightmare" because people have less tolerance for such inaccurate and unfunny claims and will call him to task for such nonsense is a bit silly.
    - dvfjsdhgfv 6y ago
      It's unfunny and inaccurate for you; other people might have a different opinion.
    - rjkennedy98 6y ago
      > inaccurate claims What is inaccurate about the claims. The English are an ethnic minority in London. That is a fact. You can say oh Englishness isn't the same as the Ethnic English, but to do that you are stripping English people of their ethnic identity and their culture. > nobody says he shouldn't have the right to make such claims Yes, please do believe that. Lots of them. It may shock you but in much of the world there isn't free speech. Imagine that. Do you think in China you can go around criticizing the government? > people have less tolerance for such inaccurate and unfunny claims and will call him to task for such nonsense is a bit silly No, they are claiming the speech itself is unsafe and trying to cancel people. There is a huge difference which you don't seem to get. And it's not silly. It's primarily about intimidation and fear that if you say the wrong thing you will lose your job, get cancelled, ect. Tolerance to intolerance is not tolerance. I sometimes wonder, do people who think like you actually know how many people died in the so called "cultural revolutions" around the world (such as in China and Russia) which happened during just the last century. It's in the tens of millions. Intellectuals and dissidents rounded up to be killed or put in gulags. People forced to pledge loyalty to causes and leaders and to be re-educated. The cultural revolution leaders in our country have already started to get rid of any kind of meritocracy (racist tests they claim). UC schools functionally banned the tests just recently. My brother was telling me that UCSF med school removed standardized testing from its admissions and in one year the Asian population went from 60% to 20%. Across academia now your ability to get in will be based on your ability to show how you contribute to the goal of diversity (via skin pigmentation of course). But I guess to some it's all silly.
      - ceejayoz 6y ago
        > The English are an ethnic minority in London. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London 63% of London was born in the UK. You mean white English, I presume? Even there, they're a plurality.
        rjkennedy98 6y ago
        Ethnically English. Can you read?
        ceejayoz 6y ago
        English isn’t an ethnicity.
        dragonwriter 6y ago
        > English isn’t an ethnicity. That’s pretty clearly not true, though the boundaries of that ethnicity will be perceived differently by different people. “The English people are a nation and an ethnic group native to England who speak the English language, and share a common history and culture. The English identity is of early medieval origin, when they were known in Old English as the Angelcynn ('family of the Angles').” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_people https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_people
      - shadowgovt 6y ago
        Has John Cleese been canceled? Because, I mean, we're talking about him right now.He doesn't seem any more ignored or paid attention to than any other member of the Python gang.
        mercer 6y ago
        I love Cleese but my impression is that among the left he's definitely not liked for a number of (sorta legitimate) reasons. just FYI.
blub 6y ago
Not the first time this kind of ad-hominem's happened in relation to PC culture: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19750395 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19750395 Notice the reasoning that person gives for calling Murray a racist. Among other things, because he refuses to call some other bloke called Robinson a racist.
aklemm 6y ago
Because decrying the loss of ethnic purity is a negative signal. History and reason should make one weary of such statements.

shadowgovt 6y ago

Because the Big Think was recorded in 2016. It's interesting to see where the Big Thoughts have led him in the intervening 3 years. Engaging ideas on their merits isn't the same as engaging them in a vacuum.

blub 6y ago
Where have the big thoughts led him? Maybe you could post that directly instead of some vague innuendo and save us all some wasted time.
- shadowgovt 6y ago
  It goes to his definition of "political correctness." It seems that what he feels needs to be culturally protected is his right to make unfunny, inaccurate claims about the nature of London without criticism. While (to my knowledge) nobody says he shouldn't have the right to make such claims, the notion that he's heading towards an "Orwellian nightmare" because people have less tolerance for such inaccurate and unfunny claims and will call him to task for such nonsense is a bit silly.
  - dvfjsdhgfv 6y ago
    It's unfunny and inaccurate for you; other people might have a different opinion.
  - rjkennedy98 6y ago
    > inaccurate claims What is inaccurate about the claims. The English are an ethnic minority in London. That is a fact. You can say oh Englishness isn't the same as the Ethnic English, but to do that you are stripping English people of their ethnic identity and their culture. > nobody says he shouldn't have the right to make such claims Yes, please do believe that. Lots of them. It may shock you but in much of the world there isn't free speech. Imagine that. Do you think in China you can go around criticizing the government? > people have less tolerance for such inaccurate and unfunny claims and will call him to task for such nonsense is a bit silly No, they are claiming the speech itself is unsafe and trying to cancel people. There is a huge difference which you don't seem to get. And it's not silly. It's primarily about intimidation and fear that if you say the wrong thing you will lose your job, get cancelled, ect. Tolerance to intolerance is not tolerance. I sometimes wonder, do people who think like you actually know how many people died in the so called "cultural revolutions" around the world (such as in China and Russia) which happened during just the last century. It's in the tens of millions. Intellectuals and dissidents rounded up to be killed or put in gulags. People forced to pledge loyalty to causes and leaders and to be re-educated. The cultural revolution leaders in our country have already started to get rid of any kind of meritocracy (racist tests they claim). UC schools functionally banned the tests just recently. My brother was telling me that UCSF med school removed standardized testing from its admissions and in one year the Asian population went from 60% to 20%. Across academia now your ability to get in will be based on your ability to show how you contribute to the goal of diversity (via skin pigmentation of course). But I guess to some it's all silly.
    - ceejayoz 6y ago
      > The English are an ethnic minority in London. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London 63% of London was born in the UK. You mean white English, I presume? Even there, they're a plurality.
      - rjkennedy98 6y ago
        Ethnically English. Can you read?
        ceejayoz 6y ago
        English isn’t an ethnicity.
        dragonwriter 6y ago
        > English isn’t an ethnicity. That’s pretty clearly not true, though the boundaries of that ethnicity will be perceived differently by different people. “The English people are a nation and an ethnic group native to England who speak the English language, and share a common history and culture. The English identity is of early medieval origin, when they were known in Old English as the Angelcynn ('family of the Angles').” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_people https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_people
    - shadowgovt 6y ago
      Has John Cleese been canceled? Because, I mean, we're talking about him right now.He doesn't seem any more ignored or paid attention to than any other member of the Python gang.
      - mercer 6y ago
        I love Cleese but my impression is that among the left he's definitely not liked for a number of (sorta legitimate) reasons. just FYI.

blub 6y ago

Not the first time this kind of ad-hominem's happened in relation to PC culture: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19750395 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19750395 Notice the reasoning that person gives for calling Murray a racist. Among other things, because he refuses to call some other bloke called Robinson a racist.

aklemm 6y ago

Because decrying the loss of ethnic purity is a negative signal. History and reason should make one weary of such statements.