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> State and federal funding go overwhelmingly to erasing the disparities in local funding. And it isn't enough. Not even close. Boulder Valley: 13.8k/student

> State and federal funding go overwhelmingly to erasing the disparities in local funding. And it isn't enough. Not even close. Boulder Valley: 13.8k/student. Pueblo: 10.5k/ea. Fort Morgan: 9.5k/student. Those are sufficiently widely varying that looking at "average spending" paints an inaccurate picture. Durham public schools: 10.5k/ea. Chapel-Hill/Carrboro: 15k/ea. https://ballotpedia.org/Analysis_of_spending_in_America%27s_largest_school_districts https://ballotpedia.org/Analysis_of_spending_in_America%27s_... Range of total spending per student spreads by over a factor of 4x.

rayiner 6y ago
First, you look at the whole country, there is in fact not a difference in most states: https://apps.urban.org/features/school-funding-do-poor-kids-get-fair-share/ https://apps.urban.org/features/school-funding-do-poor-kids-... Second, I’m not sure what your Colorado example is supposed to prove. Boulder is a much more expensive city than Pueblo. Land for schools is cheaper, salaries are lower, etc. Those costs seem roughly comparable accounting for local costs. Third, comparing spending across states is deeply misleading. The cost of schooling in Idaho (which makes up several of the lowest spending school districts in your link) bears little relation to the cost of schooling in New York (which makes up several of the highest spending school districts in your link). The irony of your example is that Idaho spends about 1/3 of what New York spends per student, and Idaho students outperform New York students: https://www.sde.idaho.gov/assessment/naep/files/general/naep-2017/NAEP-2017-Idaho-Results.pdf https://www.sde.idaho.gov/assessment/naep/files/general/naep... Fourth, even the low spending school districts in your examples spend more than European countries: https://www.statista.com/statistics/381745/education-expenditure-per-pupil-england-region-uk https://www.statista.com/statistics/381745/education-expendi.... School spending in London is about $7,402 per student. That’s substantially less than Pueblo or Durham, and only a bit more than the state average for Idaho ($7,100). I guarantee you that money goes a hell of a lot further in Durham or Boise than London!
- brandmeyer 6y ago
  And yet, we still can't afford 5 full days per week of school. 60% of all districts in our state only have funding for 4 days per week. Many of the remainder are on 4.5 days/week. > Third, comparing spending across states is deeply misleading. This is why you cannot use averages to talk about school funding relative to the rest of the OECD. That's my point. You asked for statistics in my state. I gave them, in my most recent two states of residence.
  - s1artibartfast 6y ago
    Why do you think that the individual school districts have so much of a problem providing and equivalent educations when compared to other individual school districts that have much better outcomes with less funds, even controlling for cost of living? I wonder if it has to do with the level of services expected and provided between locations, states, and counties. For example, I know that special needs students, which can be notoriously expensive to educate.
    - brandmeyer 6y ago
      I spent some time digging into the London story. Here's some facts: Spending levels are much higher than parent reported. [1] for one school chosen at random shows that their budget was almost 8000 GBP/pupil - over 30% higher than cited. Furthermore, 82% was staffing. A mere 3% is allocated to facilities. In my local school district[2], salaries for all staff add up to a little less than 60% of the budget. Facilities (21.6%) and debt service (7.6%) are a far greater fraction of our costs. In short, the "education is cheaper in London" story is a lie. Many of their costs are payed for by a different color of money entirely, and simply doesn't show up on the education budget. [1] https://schools-financial-benchmarking.service.gov.uk/school/detail?urn=134693# https://schools-financial-benchmarking.service.gov.uk/school... [2] https://www.adams12.org/financial-services/documents/fiscal-year-2019-2020-adopted-budget https://www.adams12.org/financial-services/documents/fiscal-...
      - rayiner 6y ago
        The school you picked “at random” is a community academy, which is a special kind of charter school outside the regular school system, which may also receive outside funding. So that doesn’t contradict the numbers I posted, which are for regular public schools in London. Here is another chart that’s consistent with my numbers: https://dfemedia.blog.gov.uk/2019/10/11/school-funding-allocations-2020-21/ https://dfemedia.blog.gov.uk/2019/10/11/school-funding-alloc...
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  I just wanted to say thanks for the insightful comment. I wasn't aware that this data had been compiled in such a clear and concise manner! That said, what do you think drives the disparity in outcomes between different US districts and schools, if the funding roughly tracks with cost of living? Similarly, why are schools in European countries so much more efficient in terms of educational costs? One thought on the first question that comes to my mind is that students who are impoverished or have english as a second language will not have comparable outcomes, even if their school districts have comparable funding. I wonder if one aspect of the second question is the handling of special education for disabled students. Do European countries educate these students in a different manner from the US. Is the funding taken into account when we look at per student costs?

rayiner 6y ago

First, you look at the whole country, there is in fact not a difference in most states: https://apps.urban.org/features/school-funding-do-poor-kids-get-fair-share/ https://apps.urban.org/features/school-funding-do-poor-kids-... Second, I’m not sure what your Colorado example is supposed to prove. Boulder is a much more expensive city than Pueblo. Land for schools is cheaper, salaries are lower, etc. Those costs seem roughly comparable accounting for local costs. Third, comparing spending across states is deeply misleading. The cost of schooling in Idaho (which makes up several of the lowest spending school districts in your link) bears little relation to the cost of schooling in New York (which makes up several of the highest spending school districts in your link). The irony of your example is that Idaho spends about 1/3 of what New York spends per student, and Idaho students outperform New York students: https://www.sde.idaho.gov/assessment/naep/files/general/naep-2017/NAEP-2017-Idaho-Results.pdf https://www.sde.idaho.gov/assessment/naep/files/general/naep... Fourth, even the low spending school districts in your examples spend more than European countries: https://www.statista.com/statistics/381745/education-expenditure-per-pupil-england-region-uk https://www.statista.com/statistics/381745/education-expendi.... School spending in London is about $7,402 per student. That’s substantially less than Pueblo or Durham, and only a bit more than the state average for Idaho ($7,100). I guarantee you that money goes a hell of a lot further in Durham or Boise than London!

brandmeyer 6y ago
And yet, we still can't afford 5 full days per week of school. 60% of all districts in our state only have funding for 4 days per week. Many of the remainder are on 4.5 days/week. > Third, comparing spending across states is deeply misleading. This is why you cannot use averages to talk about school funding relative to the rest of the OECD. That's my point. You asked for statistics in my state. I gave them, in my most recent two states of residence.
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  Why do you think that the individual school districts have so much of a problem providing and equivalent educations when compared to other individual school districts that have much better outcomes with less funds, even controlling for cost of living? I wonder if it has to do with the level of services expected and provided between locations, states, and counties. For example, I know that special needs students, which can be notoriously expensive to educate.
  - brandmeyer 6y ago
    I spent some time digging into the London story. Here's some facts: Spending levels are much higher than parent reported. [1] for one school chosen at random shows that their budget was almost 8000 GBP/pupil - over 30% higher than cited. Furthermore, 82% was staffing. A mere 3% is allocated to facilities. In my local school district[2], salaries for all staff add up to a little less than 60% of the budget. Facilities (21.6%) and debt service (7.6%) are a far greater fraction of our costs. In short, the "education is cheaper in London" story is a lie. Many of their costs are payed for by a different color of money entirely, and simply doesn't show up on the education budget. [1] https://schools-financial-benchmarking.service.gov.uk/school/detail?urn=134693# https://schools-financial-benchmarking.service.gov.uk/school... [2] https://www.adams12.org/financial-services/documents/fiscal-year-2019-2020-adopted-budget https://www.adams12.org/financial-services/documents/fiscal-...
    - rayiner 6y ago
      The school you picked “at random” is a community academy, which is a special kind of charter school outside the regular school system, which may also receive outside funding. So that doesn’t contradict the numbers I posted, which are for regular public schools in London. Here is another chart that’s consistent with my numbers: https://dfemedia.blog.gov.uk/2019/10/11/school-funding-allocations-2020-21/ https://dfemedia.blog.gov.uk/2019/10/11/school-funding-alloc...
s1artibartfast 6y ago
I just wanted to say thanks for the insightful comment. I wasn't aware that this data had been compiled in such a clear and concise manner! That said, what do you think drives the disparity in outcomes between different US districts and schools, if the funding roughly tracks with cost of living? Similarly, why are schools in European countries so much more efficient in terms of educational costs? One thought on the first question that comes to my mind is that students who are impoverished or have english as a second language will not have comparable outcomes, even if their school districts have comparable funding. I wonder if one aspect of the second question is the handling of special education for disabled students. Do European countries educate these students in a different manner from the US. Is the funding taken into account when we look at per student costs?