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If it is neutral (in your opinion) why mention it? Your post serves like a warning, why is it needed? Would you provide a warning if there was violence, bad lan

If it is neutral (in your opinion) why mention it? Your post serves like a warning, why is it needed? Would you provide a warning if there was violence, bad language or false idolatry?

self_awareness 6y ago
Because it's my comment about this book, and comment box on HN invites to write comments about it. Just because you're not okay with the topic I've chosen, it doesn't mean I should focus on your topic in my comment. Plus, I didn't write that it's neutral to me; I've written that I'm not judging if it's a good thing or a bad thing that this book has LGBT content in it. At the same time I'm not really fond of having my imagination fed with pretty graphical descriptions of two penises rubbing against each other. Do you allow me to have that preference (or absence of this preference)? I can imagine I'm not the only person that isn't interested in content like this, hence the comment. It's a similar situation when after reading George R. R. Martin's "Nightflyers" I've noticed that the author doesn't give much info about any character, but he did focus about sexual preferences and sexual fitness about practically everyone. I couldn't care less about someone's sexual fitness. And in this book, sexual encounters were heterosexual, it still isn't right for my taste of aesthetics. Are you satisfied with the answer? Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why.
- skj 6y ago
  > Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why. lol
- rsynnott 6y ago
  > People downvote and don't even understand why. I think probably initially because it just seemed kind of irrelevant; if this was the 1950s “there’s sex in this sci-fi!” would be notable, but it’s really very standard now, and Jemesin’s depictions aren’t notably graphic, violent, or just plain comically stupid (a common problem). You could put “warning, there’s sex in this” into most discussions of sci-fi novels. For why THIS comment is downvoted, well, you guessed yourself; obviously it’s the systemic bias against the straights!
  - self_awareness 6y ago
    > obviously it’s the systemic bias against the straights! I find it dangerous for my health that you find it funny and normal. Moreover, even my comments where I say that I'm glad I've helped someone, was downvoted. If that's not bias, I don't know what it is.
    - rsynnott 6y ago
      To be clear, I was joking. There is obviously no systemic bias against straight people. Don’t be silly.
      - self_awareness 6y ago
        It's good to know that in this thread at least one person is having fun. By the way, as for irrelevance; someone has disliked the book for being too "melodramatic", and it had no replies. But when someone dislikes the book because it has graphic gay sex scenes, the whole HN hive-mind unleashes its fury. How's that for irrelevance? I think that you're a part of the group I was talking about, that they don't even understand why they're downvoting.
        celticninja 6y ago
        So you initially claimed that the same sex relationship warning was neutral but now say you disliked the book because of it. Which is it? Also, disliking a book that covers LGBT issues is fine, you dont have to like any book. But, disliking a book because it covers LGBT issues is indicative of a certain level of bigotry.
- empath75 6y ago
  > Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why. Your warning was pure homophobia, nothing to do with people being non-gay.
- adamsea 6y ago
  Stepping back a bit the idea of “warnings” or “trigger warnings” for literature - and for arguments sake let’s consider all fiction literature - is complicated. Same as what is pornographic or not, or obscene or not - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howl#1957_obscenity_trial https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howl#1957_obscenity_trial As food for thought, I’ll also throw into the mix the classic critique of American culture that it’s easier to show someone getting shot in the face on TV or in a PG-13 film than it is to show a woman’s breasts. That America is much more comfortable with violence than it is with sex (between any set of genders).
- monkeycantype 6y ago
  I've been down voted for things i've said and i didn't enjoy it either. But however it's making you feel, please know that people aren't actually attacking you as a person, they are responding to something you said. It's the comments that are getting downvoted not you This is a place where we discuss ideas, and people are down voting your comment not to say you're a bad person, but because they don't think they are a good contribution to the conversation. That kind of feedback isn't pleasant to receive. There are people who come here who write incredibly well, you read their thoughts, attempt to reconstruct them in you're mind, and feel for a moment what it it must be like to be a smarter person. Neither you nor i, nor a fair number of the other people in this thread are that kind of writer, but the feedback we get on this forum, while not pleasant to receive when it is negative, is a chance to stop reflect and move ourselves in that direction. on the bright side, the discomfort will be brief - deng will come through and quietly tuck this thread on a back shelf and we can all go on as if it never happened : )

If it is neutral (in your opinion) why mention it? Your post serves like a warning, why is it needed? Would you provide a warning if there was violence, bad language or false idolatry?

self_awareness 6y ago

Because it's my comment about this book, and comment box on HN invites to write comments about it. Just because you're not okay with the topic I've chosen, it doesn't mean I should focus on your topic in my comment. Plus, I didn't write that it's neutral to me; I've written that I'm not judging if it's a good thing or a bad thing that this book has LGBT content in it. At the same time I'm not really fond of having my imagination fed with pretty graphical descriptions of two penises rubbing against each other. Do you allow me to have that preference (or absence of this preference)? I can imagine I'm not the only person that isn't interested in content like this, hence the comment. It's a similar situation when after reading George R. R. Martin's "Nightflyers" I've noticed that the author doesn't give much info about any character, but he did focus about sexual preferences and sexual fitness about practically everyone. I couldn't care less about someone's sexual fitness. And in this book, sexual encounters were heterosexual, it still isn't right for my taste of aesthetics. Are you satisfied with the answer? Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why.

skj 6y ago
> Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why. lol
rsynnott 6y ago
> People downvote and don't even understand why. I think probably initially because it just seemed kind of irrelevant; if this was the 1950s “there’s sex in this sci-fi!” would be notable, but it’s really very standard now, and Jemesin’s depictions aren’t notably graphic, violent, or just plain comically stupid (a common problem). You could put “warning, there’s sex in this” into most discussions of sci-fi novels. For why THIS comment is downvoted, well, you guessed yourself; obviously it’s the systemic bias against the straights!
- self_awareness 6y ago
  > obviously it’s the systemic bias against the straights! I find it dangerous for my health that you find it funny and normal. Moreover, even my comments where I say that I'm glad I've helped someone, was downvoted. If that's not bias, I don't know what it is.
  - rsynnott 6y ago
    To be clear, I was joking. There is obviously no systemic bias against straight people. Don’t be silly.
    - self_awareness 6y ago
      It's good to know that in this thread at least one person is having fun. By the way, as for irrelevance; someone has disliked the book for being too "melodramatic", and it had no replies. But when someone dislikes the book because it has graphic gay sex scenes, the whole HN hive-mind unleashes its fury. How's that for irrelevance? I think that you're a part of the group I was talking about, that they don't even understand why they're downvoting.
      - celticninja 6y ago
        So you initially claimed that the same sex relationship warning was neutral but now say you disliked the book because of it. Which is it? Also, disliking a book that covers LGBT issues is fine, you dont have to like any book. But, disliking a book because it covers LGBT issues is indicative of a certain level of bigotry.
empath75 6y ago
> Damn, such systemic bias against non-gay person is astonishing. People downvote and don't even understand why. Your warning was pure homophobia, nothing to do with people being non-gay.
adamsea 6y ago
Stepping back a bit the idea of “warnings” or “trigger warnings” for literature - and for arguments sake let’s consider all fiction literature - is complicated. Same as what is pornographic or not, or obscene or not - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howl#1957_obscenity_trial https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howl#1957_obscenity_trial As food for thought, I’ll also throw into the mix the classic critique of American culture that it’s easier to show someone getting shot in the face on TV or in a PG-13 film than it is to show a woman’s breasts. That America is much more comfortable with violence than it is with sex (between any set of genders).
monkeycantype 6y ago
I've been down voted for things i've said and i didn't enjoy it either. But however it's making you feel, please know that people aren't actually attacking you as a person, they are responding to something you said. It's the comments that are getting downvoted not you This is a place where we discuss ideas, and people are down voting your comment not to say you're a bad person, but because they don't think they are a good contribution to the conversation. That kind of feedback isn't pleasant to receive. There are people who come here who write incredibly well, you read their thoughts, attempt to reconstruct them in you're mind, and feel for a moment what it it must be like to be a smarter person. Neither you nor i, nor a fair number of the other people in this thread are that kind of writer, but the feedback we get on this forum, while not pleasant to receive when it is negative, is a chance to stop reflect and move ourselves in that direction. on the bright side, the discomfort will be brief - deng will come through and quietly tuck this thread on a back shelf and we can all go on as if it never happened : )