4 ms·

I find it kind of sad looking at what popular Youtube channels looked like 5-10+ years ago, and comparing it to their videos today. As you scroll down the list

by ve55 6y ago

I find it kind of sad looking at what popular Youtube channels looked like 5-10+ years ago, and comparing it to their videos today. As you scroll down the list of videos from oldest to newest, the lengths get longer. No longer are there any petty three minutes or five minute videos, let alone a one minute video. Now videos are all 10-25 minutes, the perfect length for maximum ad revenue. Similar things happen to the thumbnails, which start containing more and more exaggerated, sometimes creepily-so, faces, reacting to absurd images that last for a fraction of a second in the video. The titles change too, becoming more and more outrageous, begging for you to click on them and spend hours watching anticipatory and 'exciting' content. A lot of things have gotten better too, of course, and the amount of content that is available is amazing. But I do really miss when it felt like a place where people went to share videos and socialize, rather than where all the popular channels are ran like companies that follow the same clickbait format news organizations now also follow.

javajosh 6y ago
Doesn't the one activity wholly subsidize the other?
- ve55 6y ago
  They might to an extent, but I don't think it's required or necessary. Ads can go on any type of videos, and if Youtube had less traffic as a result of less clickbait, then presumably the costs to host it would be a lot less too. Apart from this, keep in mind that Youtube TV likely pulls in a ton more money, and even if it didn't, Google/Alphabet has many other larger sources of revenue that could pay for Youtube too.
graedus 6y ago
> Similar things happen to the thumbnails, which start containing more and more exaggerated, sometimes creepily-so, faces, reacting to absurd images that last for a fraction of a second in the video. There was a nice little examination of this phenomenon, dubbed YouTube Face, a couple of years ago. Article: https://openspace.sfmoma.org/2018/04/your-pretty-face-is-going-to-sell/ https://openspace.sfmoma.org/2018/04/your-pretty-face-is-goi... HN thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16803937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16803937
- wirthjason 6y ago
  In Japan so much of mainstream prime time TV programming is reactions videos. Often people reacting to food from another prefecture with a minimum of two picture-in-picture heads reach the to the video. My wife is addicted to YouTube videos / YouTubers and I think there’s a high degree of similarity. This content feels low quality and cheap to produce. I think that article captures this phenomenon well.
- C1sc0cat 6y ago
  That type thumbnails just scream desperate me to - the "one simple trick" of YouTube maybe. Not as bad as the hey watch me neck a bottle of spirits in one go idiots.
lalos 6y ago
My theory is that not everyone has their empathy highly developed, so if you exaggerate an expression you throw a wider net of people picking up the social cue and find it relatable vs micro expressions that only a minority that is observant/empathic would pick up on. This would apply to anything, even day to day interactions.
- ponker 6y ago
  Well it's also that you adjust your "magnitude" of a reading based on the extremeness of the expression. So if you see someone smiling at a toy you think it's a fun toy but if you see someone MANIACALLY CACKLING at a toy you think MAN THAT TOY IS AMAZING I WANNA SEE IT.
- smallnamespace 6y ago
  Also, a lot of YouTube's audience are teenagers, who are on average worse than adults at picking up facial emotional cues: > We tested older children, adolescents and adults on a two-alternative forced-choice discrimination task using morphed faces that varied in emotional content ... adults displayed more sensitivity to subtle changes in emotional expression than children and adolescents ... The results provide evidence for late developmental changes in emotional expression recognition with some specificity in the time course for distinct emotions. http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.469.3338&rep=rep1&type=pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.469...
xnx 6y ago
If you miss the "old YouTube" you really owe it to yourself to check out tiktok. The diversity of content there is great and nothing is even close to 10 minutes. Most YouTube videos are 30-60 seconds of good content diluted to 10:01 so they can be monetized.
- TeeMassive 6y ago
  50 cents have been deposited into your account comrade.
- swebs 6y ago
  TikTok might be banned soon, so it's probably not the best time to invest your time into it.
  - Kiro 6y ago
    Banned where? This is an international forum.
    - _ZeD_ 6y ago
      basically everywhere
    - swebs 6y ago
      On Google Play and the iPhone app store. You can physically live in some other country, but it's all for nothing so long as you continue to give all control to two American megacorps.
rootsudo 6y ago
This, 100%. I really wish it was easy to filter and ban videos, artists and types cause I really hate alot of the content on YouTube now. I've disabled comments via ublock, and the experience is more pleasant, but you do lose those gems from random people sharing knowledge or a similar song or artist. Not worth it to read through though, to much low hanging fruit and memes. This and people thinking Facebook is internet. :(
- QuesnayJr 6y ago
  The comment are somehow not as terrible as they used to be. I used to use a browser extension to block comments, so that I would never be tempted to look at them. Now they seem not so bad. (Though this could be a function of the kinds of videos I put on, which are music videos and jokey movie videos like Honest Trailers.)
zucker42 6y ago
I remember back before the ad algorithm was changed to be more favorable to ~10 minute videos, there was some complaining about how YouTube was all short, stupid videos and long form more substantial content was not viable. Personally I prefer a YouTube where the meaningful 10 minute content is viable, even if it means there's some lame content which extended to meet a minimum time.
nl 6y ago
I love the longer videos, and don't really enjoy the short-form content. I watch a lot of maker content, and a 15-20 minute clip is great. I'm very glad they are able to make enough money from it to do it full time.
rangibaby 6y ago
TV-style YouTube like Guga or Sonny Side have equaled or surpassed classic “real” TV (eg Discovery channel in the 90s) in both production values and content. That’s definitely something that has happened in the last couple of years
- Retric 6y ago
  YouTube videos still generate vastly lower revenue per minute than popular 90’s TV shows. Cheaper tools can make up some of the difference, but the economics are very different.
ramblerman 6y ago
It's incredibly sad, but it's due to our own collective demand imo. Andrew Schultz a comedian, saw a huge uptick in his success when he started doing short form videos. Ironically he also saw that people would stay on his channel longer. (described in his ted talk here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl2MQq4qO4Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl2MQq4qO4Y) Giving the user a random reward and choice more frequently between each video seems to add to the dopamine hit. And thus the addictiveness. I've certainly gone down the rabbit hole of YT myself watching 1min seinfeld clips from different episodes.
ABoldGambit 6y ago
Proper deep-dives into things with long-form content are great. I'll happily watch a 50 minute documentary by History Time, or a 2 hour deconstruction of tropes in 90s crpgs by Chris Davis. For me (and I know I speak entirely subjectively), anything less than half an hour on a subject tends to be just skimming the surface. I'm happy with the way youtube is moving towards longer form essay style content in gaming, music criticism, history, literature theories, science, geopolitics, programming and the like. Often, I wish channels like for example Caspian Report did _longer_ videos on the subjects they handle, because although people have short attention span, I think 10 minutes isn't enough time to properly talk about the politics of the countries they cover. 5 minute videos of disposable entertainment just don't really do it for me.
ammar_x 6y ago
Can't agree more except for the long-videos thing. The way YouTube works now encourages clickbait crying-for-a-click titles and silly-shocked-faces thumbnails because click-through-rate plays a huge role in video success now. In his video [0], that youtuber explains that and why he was going to shift toward using clickbait titles in his channel. Because otherwise, you would not thrive on YT. For long videos, I think sometimes even 10 minutes are not enough to convey a substantial message in a video. But I think you mean those youtubers that prolong their videos longer—without added value—just for more ads. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHsa9DqmId8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHsa9DqmId8
cellular 6y ago
Soon, it will be back to 8 minutes. YouTube is changing the required length for mid-video ads.

by ve55 6y ago

javajosh 6y ago

Doesn't the one activity wholly subsidize the other?

ve55 6y ago
They might to an extent, but I don't think it's required or necessary. Ads can go on any type of videos, and if Youtube had less traffic as a result of less clickbait, then presumably the costs to host it would be a lot less too. Apart from this, keep in mind that Youtube TV likely pulls in a ton more money, and even if it didn't, Google/Alphabet has many other larger sources of revenue that could pay for Youtube too.

graedus 6y ago

> Similar things happen to the thumbnails, which start containing more and more exaggerated, sometimes creepily-so, faces, reacting to absurd images that last for a fraction of a second in the video. There was a nice little examination of this phenomenon, dubbed YouTube Face, a couple of years ago. Article: https://openspace.sfmoma.org/2018/04/your-pretty-face-is-going-to-sell/ https://openspace.sfmoma.org/2018/04/your-pretty-face-is-goi... HN thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16803937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16803937

wirthjason 6y ago
In Japan so much of mainstream prime time TV programming is reactions videos. Often people reacting to food from another prefecture with a minimum of two picture-in-picture heads reach the to the video. My wife is addicted to YouTube videos / YouTubers and I think there’s a high degree of similarity. This content feels low quality and cheap to produce. I think that article captures this phenomenon well.
C1sc0cat 6y ago
That type thumbnails just scream desperate me to - the "one simple trick" of YouTube maybe. Not as bad as the hey watch me neck a bottle of spirits in one go idiots.

lalos 6y ago

My theory is that not everyone has their empathy highly developed, so if you exaggerate an expression you throw a wider net of people picking up the social cue and find it relatable vs micro expressions that only a minority that is observant/empathic would pick up on. This would apply to anything, even day to day interactions.

ponker 6y ago
Well it's also that you adjust your "magnitude" of a reading based on the extremeness of the expression. So if you see someone smiling at a toy you think it's a fun toy but if you see someone MANIACALLY CACKLING at a toy you think MAN THAT TOY IS AMAZING I WANNA SEE IT.
smallnamespace 6y ago
Also, a lot of YouTube's audience are teenagers, who are on average worse than adults at picking up facial emotional cues: > We tested older children, adolescents and adults on a two-alternative forced-choice discrimination task using morphed faces that varied in emotional content ... adults displayed more sensitivity to subtle changes in emotional expression than children and adolescents ... The results provide evidence for late developmental changes in emotional expression recognition with some specificity in the time course for distinct emotions. http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.469.3338&rep=rep1&type=pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.469...

xnx 6y ago

If you miss the "old YouTube" you really owe it to yourself to check out tiktok. The diversity of content there is great and nothing is even close to 10 minutes. Most YouTube videos are 30-60 seconds of good content diluted to 10:01 so they can be monetized.

TeeMassive 6y ago
50 cents have been deposited into your account comrade.
swebs 6y ago
TikTok might be banned soon, so it's probably not the best time to invest your time into it.
- Kiro 6y ago
  Banned where? This is an international forum.
  - _ZeD_ 6y ago
    basically everywhere
  - swebs 6y ago
    On Google Play and the iPhone app store. You can physically live in some other country, but it's all for nothing so long as you continue to give all control to two American megacorps.

rootsudo 6y ago

This, 100%. I really wish it was easy to filter and ban videos, artists and types cause I really hate alot of the content on YouTube now. I've disabled comments via ublock, and the experience is more pleasant, but you do lose those gems from random people sharing knowledge or a similar song or artist. Not worth it to read through though, to much low hanging fruit and memes. This and people thinking Facebook is internet. :(

QuesnayJr 6y ago
The comment are somehow not as terrible as they used to be. I used to use a browser extension to block comments, so that I would never be tempted to look at them. Now they seem not so bad. (Though this could be a function of the kinds of videos I put on, which are music videos and jokey movie videos like Honest Trailers.)

zucker42 6y ago

I remember back before the ad algorithm was changed to be more favorable to ~10 minute videos, there was some complaining about how YouTube was all short, stupid videos and long form more substantial content was not viable. Personally I prefer a YouTube where the meaningful 10 minute content is viable, even if it means there's some lame content which extended to meet a minimum time.

nl 6y ago

I love the longer videos, and don't really enjoy the short-form content. I watch a lot of maker content, and a 15-20 minute clip is great. I'm very glad they are able to make enough money from it to do it full time.

rangibaby 6y ago

TV-style YouTube like Guga or Sonny Side have equaled or surpassed classic “real” TV (eg Discovery channel in the 90s) in both production values and content. That’s definitely something that has happened in the last couple of years

Retric 6y ago
YouTube videos still generate vastly lower revenue per minute than popular 90’s TV shows. Cheaper tools can make up some of the difference, but the economics are very different.

ramblerman 6y ago

It's incredibly sad, but it's due to our own collective demand imo. Andrew Schultz a comedian, saw a huge uptick in his success when he started doing short form videos. Ironically he also saw that people would stay on his channel longer. (described in his ted talk here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl2MQq4qO4Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl2MQq4qO4Y) Giving the user a random reward and choice more frequently between each video seems to add to the dopamine hit. And thus the addictiveness. I've certainly gone down the rabbit hole of YT myself watching 1min seinfeld clips from different episodes.

ABoldGambit 6y ago

Proper deep-dives into things with long-form content are great. I'll happily watch a 50 minute documentary by History Time, or a 2 hour deconstruction of tropes in 90s crpgs by Chris Davis. For me (and I know I speak entirely subjectively), anything less than half an hour on a subject tends to be just skimming the surface. I'm happy with the way youtube is moving towards longer form essay style content in gaming, music criticism, history, literature theories, science, geopolitics, programming and the like. Often, I wish channels like for example Caspian Report did _longer_ videos on the subjects they handle, because although people have short attention span, I think 10 minutes isn't enough time to properly talk about the politics of the countries they cover. 5 minute videos of disposable entertainment just don't really do it for me.

ammar_x 6y ago

Can't agree more except for the long-videos thing. The way YouTube works now encourages clickbait crying-for-a-click titles and silly-shocked-faces thumbnails because click-through-rate plays a huge role in video success now. In his video [0], that youtuber explains that and why he was going to shift toward using clickbait titles in his channel. Because otherwise, you would not thrive on YT. For long videos, I think sometimes even 10 minutes are not enough to convey a substantial message in a video. But I think you mean those youtubers that prolong their videos longer—without added value—just for more ads. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHsa9DqmId8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHsa9DqmId8

cellular 6y ago

Soon, it will be back to 8 minutes. YouTube is changing the required length for mid-video ads.