4 ms·

But you can't expect every road to have a dedicated bike lane, right?

jamil7 6y ago
Why not? It doesn’t have to happen overnight but can be a gradual thing. Other cities have managed it.
hannob 6y ago
In Copenhagen or Amsterdam that's just the case. (Not literally every road, they don't have bike lanes in residential areas, but almost every major road with significant traffic has a bike lane in these cities.)
- flipchart 6y ago
  Not just Amsterdam, the whole of the Netherlands is like that. But more than that, there is the cultural aspect that cyclists and pedestrians are the number 1 priority on the road, then cars. None of these fancy hi-tech solutions work if the drivers don't care, and the laws don't protect cyclists.
Symbiote 6y ago
Pretty much, except for small residential (or city centre) roads. A dashed blue edge to the road means a lane separated by a kerb from cars and pedestrians. A solid blue edge means a line of paint on the road. There are also off-road paths with dashed, blue lines. The thick, translucent lines are just signed, long-distance routes; they are likely to be mostly good, but not necessarily. https://osm.org/go/0H54ISC?layers=C https://osm.org/go/0H54ISC?layers=C (Odense, a town in Denmark, just to show it isn't only Copenhagen.)
jmiserez 6y ago
In some (few) places in the world that's already the case. Pretty great for getting around and safe.
eythian 6y ago
Of course you can. Unless it's low-traffic enough that it's not needed, every road here has a dedicated bike lane, and usually it's a separate path. I think it's a legal requirement to do so. This product feels like attempting to put a technological band-aid over a poor infrastructure planning problem.
- u801e 6y ago
  >> But you can't expect every road to have a dedicated bike lane, right? > Of course you can. The road has to be wide enough to accommodate a bike lane. The absolute minimum width for a bike lane is 4 feet (not including the gutter adjoining the curb). In my town, they recently restriped a 4 lane road with a concrete raised median and sidewalks on both sides to include bike lanes. They basically narrowed the 2 general purpose traffic lanes from 12 feet to 10 feet in width and added a 4 foot wide bike lane. With the bike lane, if my bike with a 3 foot wide trailer is centered in the bike lane, I have about 0.5 feet to each side of me. A car with a mirror span of 7.5 feet centered in the 10 foot wide general purpose lane has about 1.25 feet on each side. 1.25 + 0.5 = 1.75 feet of clearance between a car in the right lane and a cyclist in the bike lane. With the old configuration, a cyclist centered in the 12 foot wide general purpose traffic lane would have 4.5 feet of space on each side. A car centered in the lane would have 2.25 feet of space on each side. 4.5 + 2.25 = 6.75 feet of space between the car in the left lane and a cyclist in the right lane. In that case, having a bike lane substantially decreased the possible passing distance between cars and bicycles. If they wanted to add the bike lane, then the road should have been at least 2 to 3 feet wider than it is now. > every road here has a dedicated bike lane, and usually it's a separate path. Those lead to issues at intersections where turning vehicles or vehicles entering the road may not see you in time when you're crossing.
  - eythian 6y ago
    I mean, you can say it doesn't work all you like, but the reality is that it does, and there is concrete (well, asphalt) evidence right outside my window and all over the rest of the city and country that it works and works well. It just requires the will to design things properly. Separated paths improve safety, they don't cause issues at intersections that I've noticed (and I've been biking through them every days for years), probably because things were designed well to account for this. It's one of those situations where good design becomes mostly invisible so it's hard to spot.
rorykoehler 6y ago
Yes you can. In fact you should demand it. Our survival as a species depends upon it.

Why not? It doesn’t have to happen overnight but can be a gradual thing. Other cities have managed it.

In Copenhagen or Amsterdam that's just the case. (Not literally every road, they don't have bike lanes in residential areas, but almost every major road with significant traffic has a bike lane in these cities.)

flipchart 6y ago
Not just Amsterdam, the whole of the Netherlands is like that. But more than that, there is the cultural aspect that cyclists and pedestrians are the number 1 priority on the road, then cars. None of these fancy hi-tech solutions work if the drivers don't care, and the laws don't protect cyclists.

Symbiote 6y ago

Pretty much, except for small residential (or city centre) roads. A dashed blue edge to the road means a lane separated by a kerb from cars and pedestrians. A solid blue edge means a line of paint on the road. There are also off-road paths with dashed, blue lines. The thick, translucent lines are just signed, long-distance routes; they are likely to be mostly good, but not necessarily. https://osm.org/go/0H54ISC?layers=C https://osm.org/go/0H54ISC?layers=C (Odense, a town in Denmark, just to show it isn't only Copenhagen.)

jmiserez 6y ago

In some (few) places in the world that's already the case. Pretty great for getting around and safe.

eythian 6y ago

Of course you can. Unless it's low-traffic enough that it's not needed, every road here has a dedicated bike lane, and usually it's a separate path. I think it's a legal requirement to do so. This product feels like attempting to put a technological band-aid over a poor infrastructure planning problem.

u801e 6y ago
>> But you can't expect every road to have a dedicated bike lane, right? > Of course you can. The road has to be wide enough to accommodate a bike lane. The absolute minimum width for a bike lane is 4 feet (not including the gutter adjoining the curb). In my town, they recently restriped a 4 lane road with a concrete raised median and sidewalks on both sides to include bike lanes. They basically narrowed the 2 general purpose traffic lanes from 12 feet to 10 feet in width and added a 4 foot wide bike lane. With the bike lane, if my bike with a 3 foot wide trailer is centered in the bike lane, I have about 0.5 feet to each side of me. A car with a mirror span of 7.5 feet centered in the 10 foot wide general purpose lane has about 1.25 feet on each side. 1.25 + 0.5 = 1.75 feet of clearance between a car in the right lane and a cyclist in the bike lane. With the old configuration, a cyclist centered in the 12 foot wide general purpose traffic lane would have 4.5 feet of space on each side. A car centered in the lane would have 2.25 feet of space on each side. 4.5 + 2.25 = 6.75 feet of space between the car in the left lane and a cyclist in the right lane. In that case, having a bike lane substantially decreased the possible passing distance between cars and bicycles. If they wanted to add the bike lane, then the road should have been at least 2 to 3 feet wider than it is now. > every road here has a dedicated bike lane, and usually it's a separate path. Those lead to issues at intersections where turning vehicles or vehicles entering the road may not see you in time when you're crossing.
- eythian 6y ago
  I mean, you can say it doesn't work all you like, but the reality is that it does, and there is concrete (well, asphalt) evidence right outside my window and all over the rest of the city and country that it works and works well. It just requires the will to design things properly. Separated paths improve safety, they don't cause issues at intersections that I've noticed (and I've been biking through them every days for years), probably because things were designed well to account for this. It's one of those situations where good design becomes mostly invisible so it's hard to spot.

rorykoehler 6y ago

Yes you can. In fact you should demand it. Our survival as a species depends upon it.