5 ms·

> It's easy to be post-lockdown but not post-pandemic What's the difference?

nthj 6y ago
A lockdown is a a government-issued stay-at-home order. The presence of such an order should be, but isn't necessarily, aligned with the presence of a prevalent disease.
- harpratap 6y ago
  Not asking for a literal definition of those words. I'm asking what's the difference in living in "post-lockdown" world vs "post-pandemic" world. Personally I think masks will become more prevalent in the west, like it is already in the east. And more remote jobs. In the grand scheme of things, these two changes seem minor to me. So what is it that I'm missing here? What grand changes in the way we live are we expecting in "post-pandemic" world?
  - perl4ever 6y ago
    I think eliminating indoor activities that involve being around a lot of other people in a confined space would be a profound change to society. Some bar owners seem very upset, to the point where they are equating closing bars with denying their right to exist and make a living and suing the government.
shard 6y ago
Here are 3 that popped into my mind after thinking about it for a minute. Maybe you can come up with others. If social distancing remains in effect, post-pandemic world would have much lower density in offices/restaurants/other large gathering locations with seating, increasing real estate costs, which will be passed onto the consumer. If social distancing is required on transportation as well, this would dramatically increase air travel costs. Not only would this require heavy rethinking in any locale which relies on tourism, but also for any conferences/conventions which have a large international attendee component, perhaps requiring a reduction in scope, or being cancelled completely as the economics no longer makes sense. In-patient hospital costs will also rise as patients can no longer be placed close to each other. Number of tele-medicine providers will rise, and how this will affect the quality of care will have to be seen.
- harpratap 6y ago
  This is all based on the assumption that the current medical tech will stay as it is. But in reality what we are seeing is much faster tests (we have already gone done from few days to get back results to couple of hours now) and much better medical care once you are infected. Which means it will become a lot easier to separate the infected from the rest of the population, rendering the healthy population to work and move freely like they used to. You can do a quick test before boarding an international flight and permitted to enter the country only if you're healthy. Contact tracing apps can easily show Green-Red passes to prove whether you can enter any restaurant, shop, hospital, etc.
  - shard 6y ago
    That's a good point. As testing technology advances, many of these will be mitigated. Although until the tests get to the point where they can give results within minutes, like the flu tests have progressed to, it will not be a complete mitigation. Another issue is cost, as once testing becomes common place, I would expect the fees to be passed onto the consumer. Also, people may not want to put up with constant testing, e.g. once every 2 weeks, unless it's a condition for employment, which might be the case for any job which requires high contact with the population.
  - bradknowles 6y ago
    Sadly, most of the tests with fast results are highly inaccurate. Their false positive rate is way, way too high. You’d get way too many people who are tagged as being positive and kept from traveling (or whatever), which would create another crisis of its own. Contact tracing only works for you if every person you’ve been in contact with is willing to participate. And that assumes you actually know all of the people you’ve spent enough time around to be considered to have contacted them.
  - listenallyall 6y ago
    >> You can do a quick test before boarding an international flight Just curious, how do anticipate this working from a business point of view? If boarding is denied due to a positive test, does the passenger get a refund? If that's the case, won't airlines overbook significantly more than they do today, which in turn will probably increase chaos? On the other hand, if tickets are non-refundable, who would gamble on purchasing an expensive ticket and then be subject to losing it due to a semi-inaccurate test?

nthj 6y ago

A lockdown is a a government-issued stay-at-home order. The presence of such an order should be, but isn't necessarily, aligned with the presence of a prevalent disease.

harpratap 6y ago
Not asking for a literal definition of those words. I'm asking what's the difference in living in "post-lockdown" world vs "post-pandemic" world. Personally I think masks will become more prevalent in the west, like it is already in the east. And more remote jobs. In the grand scheme of things, these two changes seem minor to me. So what is it that I'm missing here? What grand changes in the way we live are we expecting in "post-pandemic" world?
- perl4ever 6y ago
  I think eliminating indoor activities that involve being around a lot of other people in a confined space would be a profound change to society. Some bar owners seem very upset, to the point where they are equating closing bars with denying their right to exist and make a living and suing the government.

shard 6y ago

Here are 3 that popped into my mind after thinking about it for a minute. Maybe you can come up with others. If social distancing remains in effect, post-pandemic world would have much lower density in offices/restaurants/other large gathering locations with seating, increasing real estate costs, which will be passed onto the consumer. If social distancing is required on transportation as well, this would dramatically increase air travel costs. Not only would this require heavy rethinking in any locale which relies on tourism, but also for any conferences/conventions which have a large international attendee component, perhaps requiring a reduction in scope, or being cancelled completely as the economics no longer makes sense. In-patient hospital costs will also rise as patients can no longer be placed close to each other. Number of tele-medicine providers will rise, and how this will affect the quality of care will have to be seen.

harpratap 6y ago
This is all based on the assumption that the current medical tech will stay as it is. But in reality what we are seeing is much faster tests (we have already gone done from few days to get back results to couple of hours now) and much better medical care once you are infected. Which means it will become a lot easier to separate the infected from the rest of the population, rendering the healthy population to work and move freely like they used to. You can do a quick test before boarding an international flight and permitted to enter the country only if you're healthy. Contact tracing apps can easily show Green-Red passes to prove whether you can enter any restaurant, shop, hospital, etc.
- shard 6y ago
  That's a good point. As testing technology advances, many of these will be mitigated. Although until the tests get to the point where they can give results within minutes, like the flu tests have progressed to, it will not be a complete mitigation. Another issue is cost, as once testing becomes common place, I would expect the fees to be passed onto the consumer. Also, people may not want to put up with constant testing, e.g. once every 2 weeks, unless it's a condition for employment, which might be the case for any job which requires high contact with the population.
- bradknowles 6y ago
  Sadly, most of the tests with fast results are highly inaccurate. Their false positive rate is way, way too high. You’d get way too many people who are tagged as being positive and kept from traveling (or whatever), which would create another crisis of its own. Contact tracing only works for you if every person you’ve been in contact with is willing to participate. And that assumes you actually know all of the people you’ve spent enough time around to be considered to have contacted them.
- listenallyall 6y ago
  >> You can do a quick test before boarding an international flight Just curious, how do anticipate this working from a business point of view? If boarding is denied due to a positive test, does the passenger get a refund? If that's the case, won't airlines overbook significantly more than they do today, which in turn will probably increase chaos? On the other hand, if tickets are non-refundable, who would gamble on purchasing an expensive ticket and then be subject to losing it due to a semi-inaccurate test?