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> thousands of Uyghurs are put into concentration camps based on computer vision algorithms invented by this community I saw this repeated frequently in the la

by Udik 6y ago

> thousands of Uyghurs are put into concentration camps based on computer vision algorithms invented by this community I saw this repeated frequently in the last few days, and I think I've missed some important info. I know that China uses face recognition for surveillance purpose, and that it detains a substantial share of the Uighur population for supposed violations of the law. I miss a link between the two: is China using AI to detect who is Uighur and arrest him/ her for this very fact? Does anyone have more info?

NikolaeVarius 6y ago
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/technology/china-surveillance-artificial-intelligence-racial-profiling.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/technology/china-surveill...
- Udik 6y ago
  Thank you, but this article seems to say that the technology is used to track Uighurs (I suppose for the reason that some of them have been engaging in terrorist activities) and not to incarcerate them. Despite the scale- which we considered worrying in itself and for understandable reasons- this seems to be an automated version of "I suddenly see a lot of mafioso-looking guys congregating here, let's keep an eye to see if there's anything dodgy going on"- which has been practiced with skilled eyes since forever. And it's a whole different thing from "if I see anyone looking Jewish I'll round them up and send them to a concentration camp".
  - cycomanic 6y ago
    > Thank you, but this article seems to say that the technology is used to track Uighurs (I suppose for the reason that some of them have been engaging in terrorist activities) and not to incarcerate them. That's a weird suggestion. It's undisputed that they have put millions into detention camps, so are you suggesting they all have been engaging in "terrorist activities"? So why suggest ("suppose" ) that they have been engaging in terrorist activities? > Despite the scale- which we considered worrying in itself and for understandable reasons- this seems to be an automated version of "I suddenly see a lot of mafioso-looking guys congregating here, let's keep an eye to see if there's anything dodgy going on"- which has been practiced with skilled eyes since forever. And it's a whole different thing from "if I see anyone looking Jewish I'll round them up and send them to a concentration camp". The article literally said they are looking for (tracking) Uighurs because of their ethnic appearance. That is looking for "Jewish" , not looking "mafioso-looking" in your example above
    - Udik 6y ago
      > That's a weird suggestion. It's undisputed that they have put millions into detention camps No, the article talks about "tracking" Uighurs, not rounding them up. The Uighurs are 25 million and mostly live in the Xinjiang region, so there is no real need of AI to round them up. If what you want is to find them and imprison them, you can just go in any street of Kashgar: they make up 5/6 of the population. What the linked article says is: "The facial recognition technology, which is integrated into China’s rapidly expanding networks of surveillance cameras, looks exclusively for Uighurs based on their appearance and keeps records of their comings and goings for search and review. " (Italic mine) > The article literally said they are looking for (tracking) Uighurs because of their ethnic appearance. No, the article says they're tracking Uighurs through their ethnic appearance. Not "because" of it. > That is looking for "Jewish" , not looking "mafioso-looking" in your example above The point is whether you're looking for a visible trait because that is in and by itself the fault (and so after detecting it you immediately proceed with an arrest), or because it is somewhat predictive of something else, and it merely helps in narrowing your search.
michaelmrose 6y ago
It's not only incarcerating them it's ripping the organs out of their still living bodies to give to more wealthy factions of society.

by Udik 6y ago

NikolaeVarius 6y ago

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/technology/china-surveillance-artificial-intelligence-racial-profiling.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/technology/china-surveill...

Udik 6y ago
Thank you, but this article seems to say that the technology is used to track Uighurs (I suppose for the reason that some of them have been engaging in terrorist activities) and not to incarcerate them. Despite the scale- which we considered worrying in itself and for understandable reasons- this seems to be an automated version of "I suddenly see a lot of mafioso-looking guys congregating here, let's keep an eye to see if there's anything dodgy going on"- which has been practiced with skilled eyes since forever. And it's a whole different thing from "if I see anyone looking Jewish I'll round them up and send them to a concentration camp".
- cycomanic 6y ago
  > Thank you, but this article seems to say that the technology is used to track Uighurs (I suppose for the reason that some of them have been engaging in terrorist activities) and not to incarcerate them. That's a weird suggestion. It's undisputed that they have put millions into detention camps, so are you suggesting they all have been engaging in "terrorist activities"? So why suggest ("suppose" ) that they have been engaging in terrorist activities? > Despite the scale- which we considered worrying in itself and for understandable reasons- this seems to be an automated version of "I suddenly see a lot of mafioso-looking guys congregating here, let's keep an eye to see if there's anything dodgy going on"- which has been practiced with skilled eyes since forever. And it's a whole different thing from "if I see anyone looking Jewish I'll round them up and send them to a concentration camp". The article literally said they are looking for (tracking) Uighurs because of their ethnic appearance. That is looking for "Jewish" , not looking "mafioso-looking" in your example above
  - Udik 6y ago
    > That's a weird suggestion. It's undisputed that they have put millions into detention camps No, the article talks about "tracking" Uighurs, not rounding them up. The Uighurs are 25 million and mostly live in the Xinjiang region, so there is no real need of AI to round them up. If what you want is to find them and imprison them, you can just go in any street of Kashgar: they make up 5/6 of the population. What the linked article says is: "The facial recognition technology, which is integrated into China’s rapidly expanding networks of surveillance cameras, looks exclusively for Uighurs based on their appearance and keeps records of their comings and goings for search and review. " (Italic mine) > The article literally said they are looking for (tracking) Uighurs because of their ethnic appearance. No, the article says they're tracking Uighurs through their ethnic appearance. Not "because" of it. > That is looking for "Jewish" , not looking "mafioso-looking" in your example above The point is whether you're looking for a visible trait because that is in and by itself the fault (and so after detecting it you immediately proceed with an arrest), or because it is somewhat predictive of something else, and it merely helps in narrowing your search.

michaelmrose 6y ago

It's not only incarcerating them it's ripping the organs out of their still living bodies to give to more wealthy factions of society.