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The human ear has an intimate relationship with the octave 2:1 and its ratios, so its very hard to believe the convergence of appreciation globally to be random

by sova 6y ago

The human ear has an intimate relationship with the octave 2:1 and its ratios, so its very hard to believe the convergence of appreciation globally to be random. More dramatically, visualizing the harmonious ratios on objects such as Chladni plates (a field called Cymatics) reveals that there is something deeper to consonance and harmony than meets the number line.

marzell 6y ago
"visualizing the harmonious ratios on objects such as Chladni plates (a field called Cymatics) reveals that there is something deeper to consonance and harmony than meets the number line" Ok I'll bite. What does it reveal? There's nothing inherently meaningful here. We know that 'dissonant' sounds (those that create interference patterns) create wavelets that are smaller and with less contrast than the more 'coherent' patterns from ratios that are closer to whole numbers. But in what way is this meaningful or useful?
- megameter 6y ago
  It means we find consonance pleasurable and see a distinct "signal" in it. At least, that's the information-theoretical way of looking at it. When dealing with cosmology one often seeks to make a big deal out of a simple concept like a duality, a cycle, or a ratio. These are concepts recurring through the world, and looking for them in more places sometimes reveals knowledge.
walleeee 6y ago
There is some evidence that ratio/octave recognition and preferences for consonant sound are culturally contingent http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/McDermott_etal_2016_consonance.pdf http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/McDermott_etal_2016_conso... http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/Jacoby_etal_2019_Bolivia_sung_reproduction.pdf http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/Jacoby_etal_2019_Bolivia_... Preferences vary individually as well: modern music may feature or favor dissonance (e.g., some forms of metal, electronic)

by sova 6y ago

marzell 6y ago

"visualizing the harmonious ratios on objects such as Chladni plates (a field called Cymatics) reveals that there is something deeper to consonance and harmony than meets the number line" Ok I'll bite. What does it reveal? There's nothing inherently meaningful here. We know that 'dissonant' sounds (those that create interference patterns) create wavelets that are smaller and with less contrast than the more 'coherent' patterns from ratios that are closer to whole numbers. But in what way is this meaningful or useful?

megameter 6y ago
It means we find consonance pleasurable and see a distinct "signal" in it. At least, that's the information-theoretical way of looking at it. When dealing with cosmology one often seeks to make a big deal out of a simple concept like a duality, a cycle, or a ratio. These are concepts recurring through the world, and looking for them in more places sometimes reveals knowledge.

walleeee 6y ago

There is some evidence that ratio/octave recognition and preferences for consonant sound are culturally contingent http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/McDermott_etal_2016_consonance.pdf http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/McDermott_etal_2016_conso... http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/Jacoby_etal_2019_Bolivia_sung_reproduction.pdf http://mcdermottlab.mit.edu/papers/Jacoby_etal_2019_Bolivia_... Preferences vary individually as well: modern music may feature or favor dissonance (e.g., some forms of metal, electronic)