4 ms·

> I was arrested when I was 17 years old, and I have been in prison for over 30 yrs.; 20 yrs. of that was spent in solitary confinement, 90% of which I did in t

> I was arrested when I was 17 years old, and I have been in prison for over 30 yrs.; 20 yrs. of that was spent in solitary confinement, 90% of which I did in the windowless cells of Pelican Bay State Prison. This is beyond fucked up. Arrested as a teenager, they've now spent more time alone in a windowless concrete cell than they did growing up. There's no information on what they did to warrant this, but there's a reason even murder sentences are (usually) less than 10 years in most European countries.

capableweb 6y ago
Yeah, I can't figure out a single reason this would be OK. Even murders, rapists and other morally shitty people either deserve to get help to improve themselves, as they are obviously damaged in some way, or at least put in a place where they don't get worse. I'm not generally for death sentence, but I'd honestly change my view if the alternative to death sentence is being locked up in solitary for the rest of your life. Death in this case would be kinder. Best would be that none of those options exists.
- rectang 6y ago
  There is no animal species more savage than humans. Orcas, great cats... nothing comes close to our innovation in torture methods, deliberately hacking evolved pain mechanisms to maximize suffering. Solitary confinement is a particularly ingenious way of inflicting agony.
- mesa8 6y ago
  I find it hilarious how evil naive this forum is. Read some court documents on torture cases sometime, or even just read crime and deterrence literature.
  - capableweb 6y ago
    Evil naive? How come? I've read plenty of court cases and I'm still of the same opinion. Those people who commit those things are corrupted in some way, and need help. If your point is that they will never get better, the most human thing to do would be to execute them, rather than putting them in solitary. If there is a chance we can "fix" them, then I think we should aim for fixing them.
paganel 6y ago
> 20 yrs. of that was spent in solitary confinement Solitary confinement is pure torture, I can't even imagine how it would be to spend 20 years under those dreadful circumstances. I generally love lots of things about the US (never been there, I must admit) but I find their incarceration policies scandalous.
rpastuszak 6y ago
This might sound like a naive question, but what is the driver behind this? Economic factors? Is it cheaper to keep people in smaller spaces, in privately-owned prisons? I am genuinely curious why we hear so much about solitary confinement in American prisons specifically.
- naringas 6y ago
  it is a mistake to think that this happens due to a singular driving factor. In fact, such situation happens due to a large compounded number of "it's not my problem" and a lack of incentives to actually care. So I'm saying this is not caused by some insitutional entity doing something, but rather, by many of them not doing certain things (usually to reduce cost).
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - rpastuszak 6y ago
    Thanks, let me rephrase: what are the systemic issues in American prison system that make solitary confinement such a common practice? What are the drivers behind this? My understanding is that some of the reasons might include: - a privatised prison system - systemic racism - the % of US citizens in prisons being relatively high compared to the rest of what we call developed countries Obv. all of these are intertwined and it’s a very complex issue. I’m still struggling to understand how people in an advanced democracy like the US would allow for these things to happen. It seems like it’s considered the norm.
- sukilot 6y ago
  It not cheaper. Prisons are part of the expanded military-indistrial complex, where the goal is to spend more money for the same results so that more can be skimmed off for corruption. US prisons are the great-grandchildren of slave plantations, with broadly similar motivations.

capableweb 6y ago

Yeah, I can't figure out a single reason this would be OK. Even murders, rapists and other morally shitty people either deserve to get help to improve themselves, as they are obviously damaged in some way, or at least put in a place where they don't get worse. I'm not generally for death sentence, but I'd honestly change my view if the alternative to death sentence is being locked up in solitary for the rest of your life. Death in this case would be kinder. Best would be that none of those options exists.

rectang 6y ago
There is no animal species more savage than humans. Orcas, great cats... nothing comes close to our innovation in torture methods, deliberately hacking evolved pain mechanisms to maximize suffering. Solitary confinement is a particularly ingenious way of inflicting agony.
mesa8 6y ago
I find it hilarious how evil naive this forum is. Read some court documents on torture cases sometime, or even just read crime and deterrence literature.
- capableweb 6y ago
  Evil naive? How come? I've read plenty of court cases and I'm still of the same opinion. Those people who commit those things are corrupted in some way, and need help. If your point is that they will never get better, the most human thing to do would be to execute them, rather than putting them in solitary. If there is a chance we can "fix" them, then I think we should aim for fixing them.

paganel 6y ago

> 20 yrs. of that was spent in solitary confinement Solitary confinement is pure torture, I can't even imagine how it would be to spend 20 years under those dreadful circumstances. I generally love lots of things about the US (never been there, I must admit) but I find their incarceration policies scandalous.

rpastuszak 6y ago

This might sound like a naive question, but what is the driver behind this? Economic factors? Is it cheaper to keep people in smaller spaces, in privately-owned prisons? I am genuinely curious why we hear so much about solitary confinement in American prisons specifically.

naringas 6y ago
it is a mistake to think that this happens due to a singular driving factor. In fact, such situation happens due to a large compounded number of "it's not my problem" and a lack of incentives to actually care. So I'm saying this is not caused by some insitutional entity doing something, but rather, by many of them not doing certain things (usually to reduce cost).
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- rpastuszak 6y ago
  Thanks, let me rephrase: what are the systemic issues in American prison system that make solitary confinement such a common practice? What are the drivers behind this? My understanding is that some of the reasons might include: - a privatised prison system - systemic racism - the % of US citizens in prisons being relatively high compared to the rest of what we call developed countries Obv. all of these are intertwined and it’s a very complex issue. I’m still struggling to understand how people in an advanced democracy like the US would allow for these things to happen. It seems like it’s considered the norm.
sukilot 6y ago
It not cheaper. Prisons are part of the expanded military-indistrial complex, where the goal is to spend more money for the same results so that more can be skimmed off for corruption. US prisons are the great-grandchildren of slave plantations, with broadly similar motivations.