5 ms·

Persuasion: A Free Society Is Worth Fighting For

33 points by dsr12 6y ago

sevencolors 6y ago
Join the revolution comrade!* * 14 Day Free Trial. Then only $100 a year to learn how we can subvert capitalism
- morningplanet 6y ago
  Isn't this sentence intrinsically ironic?
Leary 6y ago
Perhaps you can spell out what political stance this community is for. I'm guessing libertarian? "The term free society is used frequently by American libertarian theorists to denote a society in which their ideal political, legal and economic aims are in effect."[1] [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_society https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_society
kleer001 6y ago
A slash screen begging for my email address then a list of people's pictures. https://www.persuasion.community/about https://www.persuasion.community/about Might be a better splash screen. A list of people that's supposedly compelling and not linked to anything about them? "A free society is worth fighting for"? And it's a forum? Who are we going to fight, each other? I'm not sold.
coderintherye 6y ago
This is really odd to see something have 19 points in only 17 minutes. I visit new often and that's anomalous behavior even for really popular posts.
- dang 6y ago
  The votes look legit to me.
bathtub365 6y ago
There's no information on this website about what it is other than a newsletter by someone named Yascha Mounk. When I skip past the pay wall it's still all about Yascha Mounk. There's no way I'm giving them money.
microcolonel 6y ago
Seems interesting. Excited to see if they can succeed at their goal of persuasion. It's getting to the point where there's nowhere to hide for people too cowardly to speak their minds; there is no hobby, no workplace, no community in North America where you can escape the cultural revolution and be left alone. Every retreat is an assault, each capitulation is friendly fire. It is time to fight with your words, and fight to win, so you don't have to do the other thing.
brian_herman 6y ago
I don't like the dark pattern at the beginning where it collects your email. Also the first page doesn't seem compelling. The blogpost should be the first page and the email collection should be at the bottom so I know what this is all about.
- coronadisaster 6y ago
  They still got your IP address, maybe.
- ryanSrich 6y ago
  That's how every substack works, unfortunately.
danieka 6y ago
Really seems interesting. But how much is it per month? I'm not going to sign up for a free trial if I don't know what the is price after the trial is over.
john_moscow 6y ago
I am glad more and more people are acknowledging the problems of cancel culture and the growing divisiveness of our society, but I totally got lost in their terminology: >The primary threat to liberal democracy is posed by the populist right. I though the term "liberal" refers to doctrine that puts the individual's feelings above many other things, and is used by the cancel culture supporters to justify the silencing of their critics. Wasn't the term for emphasizing free speech and the right to express your opinion "libertarian", not "liberal" and is considered to more right-leaning than the classical liberal school, since it recognizes less central control. So are they trying to pin the recent outrage culture on the republicans (that at least to me, appear to be strongly against it), or am tripping here?
clarkmoody 6y ago
> So please join our community if you, too, share our founding values: - We seek to build a free society in which all individuals get to pursue a meaningful life irrespective of who they are. - We believe in the importance of the social practice of persuasion, and are determined to defend free speech and free inquiry against all its enemies. - We seek to persuade, rather than to mock or troll, those who disagree with us. A free society is worth fighting for. And the best time to start is now. Am I missing something, or is a publication called Persuasion not speaking out against coercion, which is its opposite? It seems to be fighting for some ill-defined "free society" with specifics in freedom of speech and inquiry. Farther up the About page: > The primary threat to liberal democracy is posed by the populist right. Ah, got it.
rorykoehler 6y ago
It’s pretty disappointing how cynical everyone is on here. I signed up for the free tier. They have some interesting people on their board of advisors. I don’t agree with them all but that’s the point.
- kleer001 6y ago
  Cynical compared to what? "Caveat Emptor" is old as dirt. "Trust but verify" is a bit newer, but similar. Stergeons Law still holds. Caution is the watchword for intelligent people against a tide of garbage that's become the internet. > They have some interesting people on their board of advisors. How could anyone know that? Know them? Expecting strangers to research a huge list of names is unreasonable.
  - rorykoehler 6y ago
    So wait until they publish something and judge that.
    - kleer001 6y ago
      I guess it's the chicken/egg problem of bootstrapping anything.
      - rorykoehler 6y ago
        I would have thought the audience here would have more empathy for this.
yingw787 6y ago
I've personally found that once I'm comfortable with something, I don't care for the freedom for something else. If I have a car I like, I don't care for the freedom to get another car. Freedom is really only useful to those for whom the status quo is unbearable, in one way or another. How much we push for a free society is a measure of empathy for fellow citizens who haven't "made it", and it's healthy long-term planning in a world where the only constant is change and where the status quo stops working for all of us at one point or another. It's easy to succumb to comfort and think freedom isn't worth it, which is probably why wealthier societies populated with generations that have only known peace begin to rot from the inside out and why civilization ebbs and flows in cycles (bad times -> strong people -> good times -> weak people).
dundarious 6y ago
https://www.persuasion.community/p/about-persuasion-redefining-liberalism https://www.persuasion.community/p/about-persuasion-redefini... seems to have a better description of their ideology than the /about page. Essentially, their argument is that the populist right is the biggest threat to Liberal Democracy since WW2, but also that the left are not providing a reasoned defense.

33 points by dsr12 6y ago

sevencolors 6y ago

Join the revolution comrade!* * 14 Day Free Trial. Then only $100 a year to learn how we can subvert capitalism

morningplanet 6y ago
Isn't this sentence intrinsically ironic?

Leary 6y ago

Perhaps you can spell out what political stance this community is for. I'm guessing libertarian? "The term free society is used frequently by American libertarian theorists to denote a society in which their ideal political, legal and economic aims are in effect."[1] [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_society https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_society

kleer001 6y ago

A slash screen begging for my email address then a list of people's pictures. https://www.persuasion.community/about https://www.persuasion.community/about Might be a better splash screen. A list of people that's supposedly compelling and not linked to anything about them? "A free society is worth fighting for"? And it's a forum? Who are we going to fight, each other? I'm not sold.

coderintherye 6y ago

This is really odd to see something have 19 points in only 17 minutes. I visit new often and that's anomalous behavior even for really popular posts.

dang 6y ago
The votes look legit to me.

bathtub365 6y ago

There's no information on this website about what it is other than a newsletter by someone named Yascha Mounk. When I skip past the pay wall it's still all about Yascha Mounk. There's no way I'm giving them money.

microcolonel 6y ago

Seems interesting. Excited to see if they can succeed at their goal of persuasion. It's getting to the point where there's nowhere to hide for people too cowardly to speak their minds; there is no hobby, no workplace, no community in North America where you can escape the cultural revolution and be left alone. Every retreat is an assault, each capitulation is friendly fire. It is time to fight with your words, and fight to win, so you don't have to do the other thing.

brian_herman 6y ago

I don't like the dark pattern at the beginning where it collects your email. Also the first page doesn't seem compelling. The blogpost should be the first page and the email collection should be at the bottom so I know what this is all about.

coronadisaster 6y ago
They still got your IP address, maybe.
ryanSrich 6y ago
That's how every substack works, unfortunately.

danieka 6y ago

Really seems interesting. But how much is it per month? I'm not going to sign up for a free trial if I don't know what the is price after the trial is over.

john_moscow 6y ago

I am glad more and more people are acknowledging the problems of cancel culture and the growing divisiveness of our society, but I totally got lost in their terminology: >The primary threat to liberal democracy is posed by the populist right. I though the term "liberal" refers to doctrine that puts the individual's feelings above many other things, and is used by the cancel culture supporters to justify the silencing of their critics. Wasn't the term for emphasizing free speech and the right to express your opinion "libertarian", not "liberal" and is considered to more right-leaning than the classical liberal school, since it recognizes less central control. So are they trying to pin the recent outrage culture on the republicans (that at least to me, appear to be strongly against it), or am tripping here?

clarkmoody 6y ago

> So please join our community if you, too, share our founding values: - We seek to build a free society in which all individuals get to pursue a meaningful life irrespective of who they are. - We believe in the importance of the social practice of persuasion, and are determined to defend free speech and free inquiry against all its enemies. - We seek to persuade, rather than to mock or troll, those who disagree with us. A free society is worth fighting for. And the best time to start is now. Am I missing something, or is a publication called Persuasion not speaking out against coercion, which is its opposite? It seems to be fighting for some ill-defined "free society" with specifics in freedom of speech and inquiry. Farther up the About page: > The primary threat to liberal democracy is posed by the populist right. Ah, got it.

rorykoehler 6y ago

It’s pretty disappointing how cynical everyone is on here. I signed up for the free tier. They have some interesting people on their board of advisors. I don’t agree with them all but that’s the point.

kleer001 6y ago
Cynical compared to what? "Caveat Emptor" is old as dirt. "Trust but verify" is a bit newer, but similar. Stergeons Law still holds. Caution is the watchword for intelligent people against a tide of garbage that's become the internet. > They have some interesting people on their board of advisors. How could anyone know that? Know them? Expecting strangers to research a huge list of names is unreasonable.
- rorykoehler 6y ago
  So wait until they publish something and judge that.
  - kleer001 6y ago
    I guess it's the chicken/egg problem of bootstrapping anything.
    - rorykoehler 6y ago
      I would have thought the audience here would have more empathy for this.

yingw787 6y ago

I've personally found that once I'm comfortable with something, I don't care for the freedom for something else. If I have a car I like, I don't care for the freedom to get another car. Freedom is really only useful to those for whom the status quo is unbearable, in one way or another. How much we push for a free society is a measure of empathy for fellow citizens who haven't "made it", and it's healthy long-term planning in a world where the only constant is change and where the status quo stops working for all of us at one point or another. It's easy to succumb to comfort and think freedom isn't worth it, which is probably why wealthier societies populated with generations that have only known peace begin to rot from the inside out and why civilization ebbs and flows in cycles (bad times -> strong people -> good times -> weak people).

dundarious 6y ago

https://www.persuasion.community/p/about-persuasion-redefining-liberalism https://www.persuasion.community/p/about-persuasion-redefini... seems to have a better description of their ideology than the /about page. Essentially, their argument is that the populist right is the biggest threat to Liberal Democracy since WW2, but also that the left are not providing a reasoned defense.