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That's complete BS. Speeds have not been updated to match the technical characteristics of modern cars. There's a reason why Germany doesn't even have a speed l

That's complete BS. Speeds have not been updated to match the technical characteristics of modern cars. There's a reason why Germany doesn't even have a speed limit - the limit itself is pointless. They only fine you for dangerous driving.

jay_kyburz 6y ago
From Wikipedia. " In 2018, the autobahn rate of 1.7 fatality per billion traveled kilometer is less secure than both the French one at 1.4 per billion traveled kilometers, and the British one at 1.4 fatalities per vehicle-miles traveled[27]. This means the risk of fatalities per traveled vehicle kilometer is 20% higher in Germany than in France, and near 92% higher than in the UK. "
- bananasbandanas 6y ago
  Seems they are cherry-picking their cases somewhat. This graphic [1] shows a comparison of European countries with Germany pretty much in the middle. [1] https://de.statista.com/infografik/16765/todesfaelle-auf-autobahnen-im-europa-vergleich/ https://de.statista.com/infografik/16765/todesfaelle-auf-aut...
  - jay_kyburz 6y ago
    I can't read that one, but I did read a few newspaper articles on the topic and it sounds like there is a lot of debate around the issue. I can imagine its almost impossible to take into consideration all various factors like road conditions, and local cultural issues, and quality of cars and everything. I'd also like to know how much the spend building and maintaining the unrestricted stretches of road, I would imagine you don't want to hit a pothole at 180km/h But my personal view is that sacrificing safety so people can get from A to B a little faster is not worth it, and perhaps it's not clear whether or not speed is a big factor, but why risk it? Whats the rush?
    - peroporque 6y ago
      Many Autobahnen here do have a speed limit. Or too much traffic to drive fast. Those that don't do not have potholes.
    - levosmetalo 6y ago
      > But my personal view is that sacrificing safety so people can get from A to B a little faster is not worth it, and perhaps it's not clear whether or not speed is a big factor, but why risk it? Whats the rush? It's not that simple that less speed equals more safety. Even the posted link shows no correlation. Some people argue that speed in Germany is not risk, but a safety measure. German highways are already mostly overloaded with traffic. Decreasing the speed by introducing the artificial limits would effective make driving more dangerous because highways would be more crowded with drivers with less distance between, there would be more lane changing during driving, drivers will be more tired because of spending more time on the road. Also, driving at the uniform speed at the speed limit reduces awareness of the road conditions. Another topic is that limit also works as a framing. On the road where limit is 120, everyone will tend to drive around 120, regardless of conditions. For the road without speed limit, people will generally drive 100 if that's optimal speed according to the current traffic conditions. And if it's safe to drive 180, why not?
    - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
      > I would imagine you don't want to hit a pothole at 180km/h You would just kinda fly over it, unless it's huge. The faster you go, the less potholes are a problem. What's more dangerous is that braking distance is quadratic in velocity.
Tainnor 6y ago
This is just misinformation. Of course, in most places, Germany has speed limits. For example, the speed limit within cities is generally 50km/h, around schools and in residentials areas it's 30km/h and outside of towns, it's usually somewhere between 60 and 100km/h. The only exception to this are highways where, in fact, 70% of the time, there is no general speed limit. Even so, specific sections will always have speed limits (e.g. around a construction site), and additionally, there are strict rules for how to behave on the highway (in particular, it's absolutely 100% forbidden to pass a car on the right and you generally have to drive as far to the right as possible unless you want to pass a slower vehicle).
- thw0rted 6y ago
  > it's absolutely 100% forbidden to pass a car on the right Somehow, it doesn't stop all these frickin' Audis from doing it. (It's always Audis.)

jay_kyburz 6y ago

From Wikipedia. " In 2018, the autobahn rate of 1.7 fatality per billion traveled kilometer is less secure than both the French one at 1.4 per billion traveled kilometers, and the British one at 1.4 fatalities per vehicle-miles traveled[27]. This means the risk of fatalities per traveled vehicle kilometer is 20% higher in Germany than in France, and near 92% higher than in the UK. "

bananasbandanas 6y ago
Seems they are cherry-picking their cases somewhat. This graphic [1] shows a comparison of European countries with Germany pretty much in the middle. [1] https://de.statista.com/infografik/16765/todesfaelle-auf-autobahnen-im-europa-vergleich/ https://de.statista.com/infografik/16765/todesfaelle-auf-aut...
- jay_kyburz 6y ago
  I can't read that one, but I did read a few newspaper articles on the topic and it sounds like there is a lot of debate around the issue. I can imagine its almost impossible to take into consideration all various factors like road conditions, and local cultural issues, and quality of cars and everything. I'd also like to know how much the spend building and maintaining the unrestricted stretches of road, I would imagine you don't want to hit a pothole at 180km/h But my personal view is that sacrificing safety so people can get from A to B a little faster is not worth it, and perhaps it's not clear whether or not speed is a big factor, but why risk it? Whats the rush?
  - peroporque 6y ago
    Many Autobahnen here do have a speed limit. Or too much traffic to drive fast. Those that don't do not have potholes.
  - levosmetalo 6y ago
    > But my personal view is that sacrificing safety so people can get from A to B a little faster is not worth it, and perhaps it's not clear whether or not speed is a big factor, but why risk it? Whats the rush? It's not that simple that less speed equals more safety. Even the posted link shows no correlation. Some people argue that speed in Germany is not risk, but a safety measure. German highways are already mostly overloaded with traffic. Decreasing the speed by introducing the artificial limits would effective make driving more dangerous because highways would be more crowded with drivers with less distance between, there would be more lane changing during driving, drivers will be more tired because of spending more time on the road. Also, driving at the uniform speed at the speed limit reduces awareness of the road conditions. Another topic is that limit also works as a framing. On the road where limit is 120, everyone will tend to drive around 120, regardless of conditions. For the road without speed limit, people will generally drive 100 if that's optimal speed according to the current traffic conditions. And if it's safe to drive 180, why not?
  - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
    > I would imagine you don't want to hit a pothole at 180km/h You would just kinda fly over it, unless it's huge. The faster you go, the less potholes are a problem. What's more dangerous is that braking distance is quadratic in velocity.

Tainnor 6y ago

This is just misinformation. Of course, in most places, Germany has speed limits. For example, the speed limit within cities is generally 50km/h, around schools and in residentials areas it's 30km/h and outside of towns, it's usually somewhere between 60 and 100km/h. The only exception to this are highways where, in fact, 70% of the time, there is no general speed limit. Even so, specific sections will always have speed limits (e.g. around a construction site), and additionally, there are strict rules for how to behave on the highway (in particular, it's absolutely 100% forbidden to pass a car on the right and you generally have to drive as far to the right as possible unless you want to pass a slower vehicle).

thw0rted 6y ago
> it's absolutely 100% forbidden to pass a car on the right Somehow, it doesn't stop all these frickin' Audis from doing it. (It's always Audis.)