4 ms·

might be worth pointing out that this happened in Transnistria (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transnistria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transnistria) a part of

might be worth pointing out that this happened in Transnistria (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transnistria https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transnistria) a part of Moldova that has stronger political ties to Russia than to Moldova. It's complicated.

FpUser 6y ago
Why is it "complicated"? And why does that matter at all? Oh and BTW most people were from Transnistria, the factory itself is on Moldova's mainland.
- credit_guy 6y ago
  Not the GP, but probably the "complicated" part is that the Moldovan prosecutors would not be able to shut down an illegal factory in Transnistria, which is de facto independent. The fact that the workers were from Transnistria probably provided them some type of immunity for a while. It's quite unlikely that the factory and the operation itself was really unknown. It's more likely that for political reasons, the authorities needed to turn a blind eye to it. What exactly changed now, who knows? It's complicated ...
  - FpUser 6y ago
    The factory was on on Moldova's territory. Why would "authorities need to turn a blind eye to it" is beyond my comprehension. What kind of "political reasons"? That is unless they were simply paid off and are regular crooks. Got any proof of that? It looks more like you just being "creative"
    - credit_guy 6y ago
      Indeed, I don't have proof. As I said, I was not the original poster, I was just exercising a bit of critical thinking. Now, I started reading a bit into this. What I got so far is this: the authorities kept an eye on this operation for a few months. They arrested the main guys, who indeed reside on the other side of the river. These guys claim to be some sort of "inventors" who were simply experimenting with these helicopters and trying to overcome some technical obstacles. They say what they are doing on their property should not be anyone's business: they were indeed assembling helicopters, but did not sell yet anything. Given that, the authorities claim that the illegal things they did now include flying the helicopters for short periods of time without permission to fly, and bringing in the country various technical components without proper custom declarations (they had entire engines there, which they sourced from some engine manufacturers). If it comes to these types of arguments, the whole case does not appear so slam dunk. The Transnistria angle, I'm not sure if there was one. There could be a faint one, in the fact that the prosecutors did not want to arrest some resident of Transistria without a watertight case, so that's why they waited for months. Now some people claim they messed up anyway.
- ummwhat 6y ago
  Transnistria claimed independence a while ago. Only Russia acknowledges their claim but de facto Moldova has lost the monopoly on violence in that small region. Transnistria is basically following the same pattern as North Georgia or East Ukraine. Step 1 is a "separatists" group pops up overnight and declares independence. Step 2 is the totally legit "separatists" happen to do exactly the things Russia would do if they had annexed the place per se. Step 3 is Russia acknowledges the "independence" of the "breakaway" region and also denies being behind the separatists to begin with. Step 4 is Western leaders send strongly worded letters and symbolic sanctions. Step 5 is everyone forgets and the relationship status is set to "it's complicated". This is how Russia invades without invading. The relevant term of art is "hybrid warfare".
  - manquer 6y ago
    Perhaps so, Russian actions covert or overt are not justifiable. However it should kept in mind all of these areas were part of Soviet Union, it is not unreasonable for pockets of broken up CIS states to want to split away, they could be ethnically Russian minority being oppressed and want to join Russia or be independent even., their problems may be genuine.
    - cbnotfromthere 6y ago
      And who, exactly, could oppress the Russian ethnic minority in 1990, which is the year when Transnistria broke away from R. Moldova?
    - gdy 6y ago
      "Perhaps so, Russian actions covert or overt are not justifiable." Why not?
  - ClumsyPilot 6y ago
    The North Georgia part is actually known as South Ossetia and they didn't want to be part of Georgia for decades. Russia obviously used the opportunity, but the claim was not entirely without merit.
- Florin_Andrei 6y ago
  > Why is it "complicated"? When history involves territories changing owners, and Stalinist Russia was involved at some point, then things are always "complicated".
  - FpUser 6y ago
    For f.. sake what does all of this has to do with few crooks trying to move illegal helos? Does Russia have a monopoly on crime?
    - Florin_Andrei 6y ago
      Think a little wider.
      - FpUser 6y ago
        You mean use even slight hint of a chance to bash Russia/China/Whetever other Enemy Du Jour?
temp-dude-87844 6y ago
This doesn't seem to be correct. According to the press releases from the Moldovan Prosecutor-General's office, the factory is "in a locality in the Criuleni District", so it's in territory controlled by the Moldovan government. But several individuals associated with this operation, including its leader, live in territory that the Moldovan government does not control (i.e. in Transnistria). This latter complication is specifically mentioned. Press releases from the Moldovan government: http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8368/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8368/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8371/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8371/

FpUser 6y ago

Why is it "complicated"? And why does that matter at all? Oh and BTW most people were from Transnistria, the factory itself is on Moldova's mainland.

credit_guy 6y ago
Not the GP, but probably the "complicated" part is that the Moldovan prosecutors would not be able to shut down an illegal factory in Transnistria, which is de facto independent. The fact that the workers were from Transnistria probably provided them some type of immunity for a while. It's quite unlikely that the factory and the operation itself was really unknown. It's more likely that for political reasons, the authorities needed to turn a blind eye to it. What exactly changed now, who knows? It's complicated ...
- FpUser 6y ago
  The factory was on on Moldova's territory. Why would "authorities need to turn a blind eye to it" is beyond my comprehension. What kind of "political reasons"? That is unless they were simply paid off and are regular crooks. Got any proof of that? It looks more like you just being "creative"
  - credit_guy 6y ago
    Indeed, I don't have proof. As I said, I was not the original poster, I was just exercising a bit of critical thinking. Now, I started reading a bit into this. What I got so far is this: the authorities kept an eye on this operation for a few months. They arrested the main guys, who indeed reside on the other side of the river. These guys claim to be some sort of "inventors" who were simply experimenting with these helicopters and trying to overcome some technical obstacles. They say what they are doing on their property should not be anyone's business: they were indeed assembling helicopters, but did not sell yet anything. Given that, the authorities claim that the illegal things they did now include flying the helicopters for short periods of time without permission to fly, and bringing in the country various technical components without proper custom declarations (they had entire engines there, which they sourced from some engine manufacturers). If it comes to these types of arguments, the whole case does not appear so slam dunk. The Transnistria angle, I'm not sure if there was one. There could be a faint one, in the fact that the prosecutors did not want to arrest some resident of Transistria without a watertight case, so that's why they waited for months. Now some people claim they messed up anyway.
ummwhat 6y ago
Transnistria claimed independence a while ago. Only Russia acknowledges their claim but de facto Moldova has lost the monopoly on violence in that small region. Transnistria is basically following the same pattern as North Georgia or East Ukraine. Step 1 is a "separatists" group pops up overnight and declares independence. Step 2 is the totally legit "separatists" happen to do exactly the things Russia would do if they had annexed the place per se. Step 3 is Russia acknowledges the "independence" of the "breakaway" region and also denies being behind the separatists to begin with. Step 4 is Western leaders send strongly worded letters and symbolic sanctions. Step 5 is everyone forgets and the relationship status is set to "it's complicated". This is how Russia invades without invading. The relevant term of art is "hybrid warfare".
- manquer 6y ago
  Perhaps so, Russian actions covert or overt are not justifiable. However it should kept in mind all of these areas were part of Soviet Union, it is not unreasonable for pockets of broken up CIS states to want to split away, they could be ethnically Russian minority being oppressed and want to join Russia or be independent even., their problems may be genuine.
  - cbnotfromthere 6y ago
    And who, exactly, could oppress the Russian ethnic minority in 1990, which is the year when Transnistria broke away from R. Moldova?
  - gdy 6y ago
    "Perhaps so, Russian actions covert or overt are not justifiable." Why not?
- ClumsyPilot 6y ago
  The North Georgia part is actually known as South Ossetia and they didn't want to be part of Georgia for decades. Russia obviously used the opportunity, but the claim was not entirely without merit.
Florin_Andrei 6y ago
> Why is it "complicated"? When history involves territories changing owners, and Stalinist Russia was involved at some point, then things are always "complicated".
- FpUser 6y ago
  For f.. sake what does all of this has to do with few crooks trying to move illegal helos? Does Russia have a monopoly on crime?
  - Florin_Andrei 6y ago
    Think a little wider.
    - FpUser 6y ago
      You mean use even slight hint of a chance to bash Russia/China/Whetever other Enemy Du Jour?

temp-dude-87844 6y ago

This doesn't seem to be correct. According to the press releases from the Moldovan Prosecutor-General's office, the factory is "in a locality in the Criuleni District", so it's in territory controlled by the Moldovan government. But several individuals associated with this operation, including its leader, live in territory that the Moldovan government does not control (i.e. in Transnistria). This latter complication is specifically mentioned. Press releases from the Moldovan government: http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8368/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8368/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8371/ http://procuratura.md/md/newslst/1211/1/8371/