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Or for a lot less money just get a motorhome. My 32' Winnebago sleeps me, wife, kids and dogs has a 4000w generator and 3000w inverter which runs off two golf

Or for a lot less money just get a motorhome. My 32' Winnebago sleeps me, wife, kids and dogs has a 4000w generator and 3000w inverter which runs off two golf cart batteries charged by shore, generator, alternator and 300w of solar. It has 80 gallons of gas, 70 gallons of water, air conditioning, and giant awning and tons of storage. I carry just about all my tools. It even has a built in desk in the passenger side dash which I can work remote from using the hotspot / router with external antenna. I driven cross country multiple times towing my Jeep and taken it pretty far off the grid. Its not an off-road vehicle but you would be surprised. There are a lot of choices in between mine and a Unicat as well, like a 4x4 Class B or Super C. Some of them are starting to do large 48v secondary alternators with lithium banks and no generator while still being able to run the A/C for up to 8 hours before recharging.

voisin 6y ago
The problem with RVs (as someone who spent most of last year on the road living in one) is that they are built like garbage, with the poorest quality materials and zero innovation. It is clear that no one has shaken up that industry in decades and the incumbents are lazy. The distribution chain has fat profits for everyone. Huge opportunity for someone to disrupt.
- SigmundA 6y ago
  I agree, but a lot of enjoyment can still be had with one. My Winnebago cost about as much as a Model X but the places I have gone, the things I have seen... Its actually very hard to travel by normal car or air now, we just like taking the RV, the space, bathroom and kitchen while driving down the road, our own bed... You really do need to be handy to own one at this point, it's like a 70's American car. Well the engine and transmission and chassis is fine but everything around it, wow. Luckily it is easy to work on and modify. I have thought long and hard about trying to start a "Toyota of RVs", I think if you could make a solid, simple well made RV you could dominate the market.
  - datavirtue 6y ago
    People make them. They are $400k used.
  - troydavis 6y ago
    The closest to a “Toyota of RVs” is probably the Erwin Hymer Group, which is expected to finally - after 5+ years of false starts - bring some products to the US in the next 2-3 years: https://newatlas.com/automotive/hymer-usa-european-designed-campers-us/ https://newatlas.com/automotive/hymer-usa-european-designed-... (Many in the US have never heard of Hymer even though they’re huge in Europe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymer. They’re now owned by Thor, which owns Airstream, Jayco, and many other RV companies: https://www.thorindustries.com/brands https://www.thorindustries.com/brands)
    - ngcc_hk 6y ago
      Good to investigate in uk
    - SigmundA 6y ago
      Hymer North America went bankrupt due various finial "irregularities". I believe what was left was bought by Thor. Left a lot of people out in the cold on warranties from my understanding. If you want quality look at https://advanced-rv.com https://advanced-rv.com, not cheap.
      - troydavis 6y ago
        Thor planned to acquire Hymer Europe and NA, but discovered the fraud during due diligence and elected not to acquire the NA business (a lot of which was Roadtrek). Thor/Hymer Europe has formed a new US entity for new products. Most of the high-volume brands are a notch down from there. I agree about Advanced. A notch down would be Safari Condo’s XL Flex and Leisure Travel Vans.
  - smabie 6y ago
    Do you think you're missing something by not being "part" of the environment while driving? As in, you drive through instead of "drive in"? I only drive with the windows down because I want to be a part of the landscape I'm in. I think a motorcycle is the ultimate crystallization of that. On the hand, if it convincs you make trips you otherwise wouldn't have made, I think it's a win. I love Road tripping because it forces you to deal with stuff, especially if you're doing it in less developed countries. Probably the most fun I've ever had is driving long distance in Africa. You really never know what's going to happen next!
- m463 6y ago
  You get what you pay for. Class A diesel RVs are designed for retired couples to drive around the country and live quite well. They plummet in price the first few years and if you're past 10 years old (usually harder to get a loan), the price drops more, often to 25% or less of the new price. They have pretty beefy systems, with 7kw diesel generators quite common. The engine and chassis will be designed to flat tow a car (or a huge trailer). And some have pretty interesting features, like tile floors, two bathrooms, in-floor heating, two bathrooms and washer/dryers. but yeah, choose a good brand.
  - SigmundA 6y ago
    Yeah sorta, its amazing how bad the QA is even on expensive motorhomes. If you are used to buying a reliable modern car you will be in for a shock when purchasing even a high end RV when it comes to the quality and integration.
    - FireBeyond 6y ago
      Yeah, one of my friends just bought a brand new RV (I don't know the details), but spent basically a month after purchase getting a whole bunch of QA fixes made, from the minor and cosmetic to fairly major.
    - Johnny555 6y ago
      Get a class C that's built on an off the shelf truck chassis (usually Mercedes Sprinter or Ford E-350/450) and at least the chassis will be reliable. You'll still have to deal with problems with the RV parts but at least you'll be able to drive it (unless your problem is that the slide-out won't retract)
      - voisin 6y ago
        I agree with this statement and I should have been clearer previously. When I complain about build quality and lack of innovation, it is solely with respect to what the RV assembler does with the Mercedes or Ford chassis.
- Cthulhu_ 6y ago
  They're built like crap because they have to be lightweight and affordable.
  - voisin 6y ago
    They are not lightweight. In the case of many Class C motorhomes build on the Ford E chassis, the manufacturer has used plywood for everything. There are certainly opportunities to build with marginally more expensive materials to make major weight gains.
    - pastrami_panda 6y ago
      For the uninitiated, what materials are we talking about here?
      - jessaustin 6y ago
        The plywood mentioned by GP is kind of heavy, and it needs framing for stiffness too. The molded steel used in "real" cars and trucks would be lighter. So would something handmade from carbon. Just thinking by analogy with boat hulls, I don't see why fiberglass wouldn't work either. My parents have a pickup camper the walls of which are made from Styrofoam or something similar. This seems to work; I can climb on the roof to adjust the antenna and I'm fat.
jcims 6y ago
Hey quick question, what's your goto RV forum/community? Just looking at getting into it this year and planning to rent one about that size for a couple of weeks in August.
- SigmundA 6y ago
  http://irv2.com http://irv2.com its definitely an older crowd but thats changing somewhat, tons of good info going back many years. https://www.rvmobileinternet.com https://www.rvmobileinternet.com for cellular / internet connectivity.
  - jcims 6y ago
    Awesome thank you!!!
godelski 6y ago
Drawback, they are big. Frankly since I don't have a family I'd rather have the truck with the generator and set up my hammock or tent rather than the RV. I can still use the truck as a utility vehicle to do all my hobby projects and use it like I would an RV. With a RV I need another vehicle. (I'm also sure I could rig a solar panel "roof" to the truck for extended trips).
- SigmundA 6y ago
  Look at Class B van conversion, the Winnebago Revel is what I would have if single / no kids, I have seen people using as daily driver.
  - godelski 6y ago
    That is pretty neat. But at the same time, I have to say that a F150 is a lot smaller than that. Also, having a truck bed is pretty darn useful if you like to build stuff.
  - starpilot 6y ago
    Holy fuck, $174k?!? How well do these hold value and much does it cost to maintain? If it's $30k in the first year, that's approximately the cost of an Airbnb every single night.
    - alistairSH 6y ago
      $174k is bonkers for that RV. It's a converted Mercedes Sprinter, which has a list price of about $60k (4x4, diesel, long wheelbase, high roof, with a reasonable set of options). I find it hard to believe Winneago adds $110k of value to the van. FWIW, if you want a camper van (and not a full RV), Metris conversions are a solid option. PeaceVans (Seattle) has two nice builds - a weekender (bed, pop top, no kitchen nor bath) or a camper (bed, pop top, kitchen, no bath). About $65k for the former and $85 for the latter. Using one of these (or a 40-year old VW Westfalia) limits you to campsites with toilets (or roughing it a bit). The Weekender build is available through your local M-B dealer (via an official up-fitter arrangement).
datavirtue 6y ago
And it gets 7mpg and needs to tow a sensible transport vehical or you are trapped. You can leave home with a huge popup behind one of these amazing f150s and never look back...getting 22mpg the whole way. Truck cap and you are totally golden. I have even used one of those extension hitches to mount a bike rack and my camper to the ball hitch. You can put bikes on top of the popup if you need to. I have had them all...pop ups are the only campers worth the trouble and money.
rloomba 6y ago
Did you buy your RV new with all of those features or did you customize yourself? What model did you end up going with?
- SigmundA 6y ago
  I added the inverter, solar and cellular antenna and router.
paulmd 6y ago
Coach motorhomes are kind of an idiot trap. You're better off with a tow vehicle and fifth wheel. The mileage is better, and you can unhitch and run day trips without having to lift your jacks and unplug everything every single day, then come home and do it all over again every single day. A lot of people end up dragging a car behind their motorhome as a result, when you could just do a fifth wheel and a truck instead and end up with a much easier rig to manage. The sprinter type campervan setups are a little more practical but obviously trade for space.
- Johnny555 6y ago
  I have no need for a pickup, so I'm better served by a 25 foot RV than an 18 foot truck plus a 25 foot fifth wheel. Plus I'd have to find parking for 2 vehicles that don't fit in my garage, while with the RV I need just one space. It's debatable whether the truck+trailer is easier to manage than the RV + small car. Though since we tend to take the RV to state parks and such where we don't need to drive after we park, we rarely take the car.
  - msisk6 6y ago
    Everyone has different needs, but having owned pretty much every type of RV available, I'd say a truck with a fifth-wheel is much easier to mange than a coach with a flat-tow car. A fifth-wheel is easy to backup when needed. A coach with a flat-tow car attached can't back up at all. And as long as you have enough truck for the size fifth-wheel you have they tow much better in wind and handle curvy roads well.
    - Johnny555 6y ago
      While it's true that you can't back up with a towed vehicle, the advantage of the RV is that you don't have to -- only takes a few minutes to pull the pins and free the car and generally when I'm towing the car, I want to use it, so I'm going to unhook it anyway when I park, may as well unhook it before I back in the space (especially since I typically want to back in all the way and put the car in front) But as you say, different use cases for different people - if you already have or want a truck (or other tow vehicle), a towed RV makes a lot more sense. But I don't want a daily driver that's large enough to be a tow vehicle and it makes no sense to buy a tow vehicle that's only used for towing.
m_mueller 6y ago
Check out "Captain Fantastic" with Viggo Mortensen. A pretty good road movie where he uses an old school bus as a motor home for his hippy family.

voisin 6y ago

The problem with RVs (as someone who spent most of last year on the road living in one) is that they are built like garbage, with the poorest quality materials and zero innovation. It is clear that no one has shaken up that industry in decades and the incumbents are lazy. The distribution chain has fat profits for everyone. Huge opportunity for someone to disrupt.

SigmundA 6y ago
I agree, but a lot of enjoyment can still be had with one. My Winnebago cost about as much as a Model X but the places I have gone, the things I have seen... Its actually very hard to travel by normal car or air now, we just like taking the RV, the space, bathroom and kitchen while driving down the road, our own bed... You really do need to be handy to own one at this point, it's like a 70's American car. Well the engine and transmission and chassis is fine but everything around it, wow. Luckily it is easy to work on and modify. I have thought long and hard about trying to start a "Toyota of RVs", I think if you could make a solid, simple well made RV you could dominate the market.
- datavirtue 6y ago
  People make them. They are $400k used.
- troydavis 6y ago
  The closest to a “Toyota of RVs” is probably the Erwin Hymer Group, which is expected to finally - after 5+ years of false starts - bring some products to the US in the next 2-3 years: https://newatlas.com/automotive/hymer-usa-european-designed-campers-us/ https://newatlas.com/automotive/hymer-usa-european-designed-... (Many in the US have never heard of Hymer even though they’re huge in Europe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymer. They’re now owned by Thor, which owns Airstream, Jayco, and many other RV companies: https://www.thorindustries.com/brands https://www.thorindustries.com/brands)
  - ngcc_hk 6y ago
    Good to investigate in uk
  - SigmundA 6y ago
    Hymer North America went bankrupt due various finial "irregularities". I believe what was left was bought by Thor. Left a lot of people out in the cold on warranties from my understanding. If you want quality look at https://advanced-rv.com https://advanced-rv.com, not cheap.
    - troydavis 6y ago
      Thor planned to acquire Hymer Europe and NA, but discovered the fraud during due diligence and elected not to acquire the NA business (a lot of which was Roadtrek). Thor/Hymer Europe has formed a new US entity for new products. Most of the high-volume brands are a notch down from there. I agree about Advanced. A notch down would be Safari Condo’s XL Flex and Leisure Travel Vans.
- smabie 6y ago
  Do you think you're missing something by not being "part" of the environment while driving? As in, you drive through instead of "drive in"? I only drive with the windows down because I want to be a part of the landscape I'm in. I think a motorcycle is the ultimate crystallization of that. On the hand, if it convincs you make trips you otherwise wouldn't have made, I think it's a win. I love Road tripping because it forces you to deal with stuff, especially if you're doing it in less developed countries. Probably the most fun I've ever had is driving long distance in Africa. You really never know what's going to happen next!
m463 6y ago
You get what you pay for. Class A diesel RVs are designed for retired couples to drive around the country and live quite well. They plummet in price the first few years and if you're past 10 years old (usually harder to get a loan), the price drops more, often to 25% or less of the new price. They have pretty beefy systems, with 7kw diesel generators quite common. The engine and chassis will be designed to flat tow a car (or a huge trailer). And some have pretty interesting features, like tile floors, two bathrooms, in-floor heating, two bathrooms and washer/dryers. but yeah, choose a good brand.
- SigmundA 6y ago
  Yeah sorta, its amazing how bad the QA is even on expensive motorhomes. If you are used to buying a reliable modern car you will be in for a shock when purchasing even a high end RV when it comes to the quality and integration.
  - FireBeyond 6y ago
    Yeah, one of my friends just bought a brand new RV (I don't know the details), but spent basically a month after purchase getting a whole bunch of QA fixes made, from the minor and cosmetic to fairly major.
  - Johnny555 6y ago
    Get a class C that's built on an off the shelf truck chassis (usually Mercedes Sprinter or Ford E-350/450) and at least the chassis will be reliable. You'll still have to deal with problems with the RV parts but at least you'll be able to drive it (unless your problem is that the slide-out won't retract)
    - voisin 6y ago
      I agree with this statement and I should have been clearer previously. When I complain about build quality and lack of innovation, it is solely with respect to what the RV assembler does with the Mercedes or Ford chassis.
Cthulhu_ 6y ago
They're built like crap because they have to be lightweight and affordable.
- voisin 6y ago
  They are not lightweight. In the case of many Class C motorhomes build on the Ford E chassis, the manufacturer has used plywood for everything. There are certainly opportunities to build with marginally more expensive materials to make major weight gains.
  - pastrami_panda 6y ago
    For the uninitiated, what materials are we talking about here?
    - jessaustin 6y ago
      The plywood mentioned by GP is kind of heavy, and it needs framing for stiffness too. The molded steel used in "real" cars and trucks would be lighter. So would something handmade from carbon. Just thinking by analogy with boat hulls, I don't see why fiberglass wouldn't work either. My parents have a pickup camper the walls of which are made from Styrofoam or something similar. This seems to work; I can climb on the roof to adjust the antenna and I'm fat.

jcims 6y ago

Hey quick question, what's your goto RV forum/community? Just looking at getting into it this year and planning to rent one about that size for a couple of weeks in August.

SigmundA 6y ago
http://irv2.com http://irv2.com its definitely an older crowd but thats changing somewhat, tons of good info going back many years. https://www.rvmobileinternet.com https://www.rvmobileinternet.com for cellular / internet connectivity.
- jcims 6y ago
  Awesome thank you!!!

godelski 6y ago

Drawback, they are big. Frankly since I don't have a family I'd rather have the truck with the generator and set up my hammock or tent rather than the RV. I can still use the truck as a utility vehicle to do all my hobby projects and use it like I would an RV. With a RV I need another vehicle. (I'm also sure I could rig a solar panel "roof" to the truck for extended trips).

SigmundA 6y ago
Look at Class B van conversion, the Winnebago Revel is what I would have if single / no kids, I have seen people using as daily driver.
- godelski 6y ago
  That is pretty neat. But at the same time, I have to say that a F150 is a lot smaller than that. Also, having a truck bed is pretty darn useful if you like to build stuff.
- starpilot 6y ago
  Holy fuck, $174k?!? How well do these hold value and much does it cost to maintain? If it's $30k in the first year, that's approximately the cost of an Airbnb every single night.
  - alistairSH 6y ago
    $174k is bonkers for that RV. It's a converted Mercedes Sprinter, which has a list price of about $60k (4x4, diesel, long wheelbase, high roof, with a reasonable set of options). I find it hard to believe Winneago adds $110k of value to the van. FWIW, if you want a camper van (and not a full RV), Metris conversions are a solid option. PeaceVans (Seattle) has two nice builds - a weekender (bed, pop top, no kitchen nor bath) or a camper (bed, pop top, kitchen, no bath). About $65k for the former and $85 for the latter. Using one of these (or a 40-year old VW Westfalia) limits you to campsites with toilets (or roughing it a bit). The Weekender build is available through your local M-B dealer (via an official up-fitter arrangement).

datavirtue 6y ago

And it gets 7mpg and needs to tow a sensible transport vehical or you are trapped. You can leave home with a huge popup behind one of these amazing f150s and never look back...getting 22mpg the whole way. Truck cap and you are totally golden. I have even used one of those extension hitches to mount a bike rack and my camper to the ball hitch. You can put bikes on top of the popup if you need to. I have had them all...pop ups are the only campers worth the trouble and money.

rloomba 6y ago

Did you buy your RV new with all of those features or did you customize yourself? What model did you end up going with?

SigmundA 6y ago
I added the inverter, solar and cellular antenna and router.

paulmd 6y ago

Coach motorhomes are kind of an idiot trap. You're better off with a tow vehicle and fifth wheel. The mileage is better, and you can unhitch and run day trips without having to lift your jacks and unplug everything every single day, then come home and do it all over again every single day. A lot of people end up dragging a car behind their motorhome as a result, when you could just do a fifth wheel and a truck instead and end up with a much easier rig to manage. The sprinter type campervan setups are a little more practical but obviously trade for space.

Johnny555 6y ago
I have no need for a pickup, so I'm better served by a 25 foot RV than an 18 foot truck plus a 25 foot fifth wheel. Plus I'd have to find parking for 2 vehicles that don't fit in my garage, while with the RV I need just one space. It's debatable whether the truck+trailer is easier to manage than the RV + small car. Though since we tend to take the RV to state parks and such where we don't need to drive after we park, we rarely take the car.
- msisk6 6y ago
  Everyone has different needs, but having owned pretty much every type of RV available, I'd say a truck with a fifth-wheel is much easier to mange than a coach with a flat-tow car. A fifth-wheel is easy to backup when needed. A coach with a flat-tow car attached can't back up at all. And as long as you have enough truck for the size fifth-wheel you have they tow much better in wind and handle curvy roads well.
  - Johnny555 6y ago
    While it's true that you can't back up with a towed vehicle, the advantage of the RV is that you don't have to -- only takes a few minutes to pull the pins and free the car and generally when I'm towing the car, I want to use it, so I'm going to unhook it anyway when I park, may as well unhook it before I back in the space (especially since I typically want to back in all the way and put the car in front) But as you say, different use cases for different people - if you already have or want a truck (or other tow vehicle), a towed RV makes a lot more sense. But I don't want a daily driver that's large enough to be a tow vehicle and it makes no sense to buy a tow vehicle that's only used for towing.

m_mueller 6y ago

Check out "Captain Fantastic" with Viggo Mortensen. A pretty good road movie where he uses an old school bus as a motor home for his hippy family.