4 ms·

This is equivalent to saying that mobs are not inherently bad - since they often lynch bad people. Think about that.

by koheripbal 6y ago

joshuamorton 6y ago
It's not, because lynching and cancelling aren't remotely equivalent.
- koheripbal 6y ago
  You're missing the point that mobs are not justice, just because they happen to side with you often. To make the analogy more in-line with your pedantry, imagine that it's a mob that's smashing storefronts rather than killing people.
  - joshuamorton 6y ago
    Are you suggesting cancelers are commiting crimes? Ultimately what you're trying to say, it appears, is that people who are choosing to speak out about injustice are bad actors because other people choose to listen to them. The injustice!
    - Udik 6y ago
      > Are you suggesting cancelers are commiting crimes? I think they are, it's harassment and mobbing. They should be prosecuted and given serious fines and in some cases jailed.
      - joshuamorton 6y ago
        I think you'll find that there are essentially no jurisdictions where voicing your displeasure about someone's actions is a crime. In most US jurisdictions, Harassment requires the (credible) threat of violence. Otherwise it's just speech, and protected like any other speech. My understanding is that this is true in most international jurisdictions as well. Do you consider yourself a supporter of "free speech"? This concept is so fraught: if I say that I believe someone did a bad thing, that's acceptable. But if a bunch of other people agree with me, suddenly I've committed a crime.
        Udik 6y ago
        from : https://www.pandasecurity.com/mediacenter/panda-security/how-to-handle-online-harassment/ https://www.pandasecurity.com/mediacenter/panda-security/how... "Cyberstalking is the act of using the Internet to systematically and repeatedly harass, threaten or intimidate someone. This can be done through email, social media, chat rooms, instant messaging or other online mediums." "Cyberstalking is a federal offense and many states have cyberstalking laws. Cyberstalking falls under anti-stalking, slander and harassment laws that are already in place and are punished similarly." from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberstalking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberstalking "There have been a number of attempts by experts and legislators to define cyberstalking. It is generally understood to be the use of the Internet or other electronic means to stalk or harass an individual, a group, or an organization. [...] Stalking is a continuous process, consisting of a series of actions, each of which may be entirely legal in itself." "Cyberstalking is a technologically-based "attack" on one person who has been targeted specifically for that attack for reasons of anger, revenge or control. Cyberstalking can take many forms, including: 1 - harassment, embarrassment and humiliation of the victim 2 - emptying bank accounts or other economic control such as ruining the victim's credit score 3 - harassing family, friends and employers to isolate the victim 4 - scare tactics to instill fear and more"
        joshuamorton 6y ago
        So are are suggesting that "I don't approve of your opinion on this topic" is equivalent to "threatening her with rape and strangulation, publishing her home address and Social Security number, and posting doctored photographs of her.", to quote the wikipedia article you linked? Or perhaps more specifically, can you present an example of cancelling that was done "specifically [...] for reasons of anger, revenge or control", and not due to other reasons, and that includes embarrassment and humiliation, economic control like ruining the credit score, harassing family and friends or employers, or scare tactics to instill fear? I can't. You trying to frame people being upset with someone's actions and expression views you disagree with as stalking is an interesting take, I'll give you that.
        6y ago

This is equivalent to saying that mobs are not inherently bad - since they often lynch bad people. Think about that.

joshuamorton 6y ago

It's not, because lynching and cancelling aren't remotely equivalent.

koheripbal 6y ago
You're missing the point that mobs are not justice, just because they happen to side with you often. To make the analogy more in-line with your pedantry, imagine that it's a mob that's smashing storefronts rather than killing people.
- joshuamorton 6y ago
  Are you suggesting cancelers are commiting crimes? Ultimately what you're trying to say, it appears, is that people who are choosing to speak out about injustice are bad actors because other people choose to listen to them. The injustice!
  - Udik 6y ago
    > Are you suggesting cancelers are commiting crimes? I think they are, it's harassment and mobbing. They should be prosecuted and given serious fines and in some cases jailed.
    - joshuamorton 6y ago
      I think you'll find that there are essentially no jurisdictions where voicing your displeasure about someone's actions is a crime. In most US jurisdictions, Harassment requires the (credible) threat of violence. Otherwise it's just speech, and protected like any other speech. My understanding is that this is true in most international jurisdictions as well. Do you consider yourself a supporter of "free speech"? This concept is so fraught: if I say that I believe someone did a bad thing, that's acceptable. But if a bunch of other people agree with me, suddenly I've committed a crime.
      - Udik 6y ago
        from : https://www.pandasecurity.com/mediacenter/panda-security/how-to-handle-online-harassment/ https://www.pandasecurity.com/mediacenter/panda-security/how... "Cyberstalking is the act of using the Internet to systematically and repeatedly harass, threaten or intimidate someone. This can be done through email, social media, chat rooms, instant messaging or other online mediums." "Cyberstalking is a federal offense and many states have cyberstalking laws. Cyberstalking falls under anti-stalking, slander and harassment laws that are already in place and are punished similarly." from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberstalking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberstalking "There have been a number of attempts by experts and legislators to define cyberstalking. It is generally understood to be the use of the Internet or other electronic means to stalk or harass an individual, a group, or an organization. [...] Stalking is a continuous process, consisting of a series of actions, each of which may be entirely legal in itself." "Cyberstalking is a technologically-based "attack" on one person who has been targeted specifically for that attack for reasons of anger, revenge or control. Cyberstalking can take many forms, including: 1 - harassment, embarrassment and humiliation of the victim 2 - emptying bank accounts or other economic control such as ruining the victim's credit score 3 - harassing family, friends and employers to isolate the victim 4 - scare tactics to instill fear and more"
        joshuamorton 6y ago
        So are are suggesting that "I don't approve of your opinion on this topic" is equivalent to "threatening her with rape and strangulation, publishing her home address and Social Security number, and posting doctored photographs of her.", to quote the wikipedia article you linked? Or perhaps more specifically, can you present an example of cancelling that was done "specifically [...] for reasons of anger, revenge or control", and not due to other reasons, and that includes embarrassment and humiliation, economic control like ruining the credit score, harassing family and friends or employers, or scare tactics to instill fear? I can't. You trying to frame people being upset with someone's actions and expression views you disagree with as stalking is an interesting take, I'll give you that.
        6y ago