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If you're raised in India, it is relatively easy to determine someone's general (varna) caste and specific (jati) caste from their familial name(s) and/or physi

by rudiv 6y ago

If you're raised in India, it is relatively easy to determine someone's general (varna) caste and specific (jati) caste from their familial name(s) and/or physical appearance. You can pick these things up by osmosis from adults (my case), through being taught, or simply through caste-influenced culture. It's quite complicated, and I'm not an expert. You don't even have to be Hindu to be a part of the caste system - Muslims and Christians may retain a familial name that is a marker of caste; in some cases, even without a name as a marker someone who knows of your particular community may be able to tell what caste a non-Hindu is simply by knowing what community you're from and being able to tell what caste that community is historically.

paloaltokid 6y ago
> it is relatively easy to determine someone's general (varna) caste and specific (jati) caste from their familial name(s) and/or physical appearance. Is this because people from a specific caste tend to concentrate in a specific geographic region? I've learned as a Westerner that there's no model I've grown up with that's really the best for making sense of India as someone who wasn't born there. What makes the most sense to me is what an Indian colleague told me - "think of it as the United States of Europe -- that many languages, that much diversity, that much complexity and problems."
- youeseh 6y ago
  No, not geographic. Unlike ethnicity or color, the caste system is racial discrimination based on profession. In old Indian kingdoms, there were warriors, priests, teachers, business people, janitors etc. The caste system basically puts a social value on each of these with priests (who were also teachers) being at the top. The problem is, you couldn't just choose to be a priest.. or a warrior.. or a janitor. You were born into the profession. You were a janitor because your father was a janitor and his father before him. Discriminating based on caste for the purposes of education, work, government services, etc.. has been outlawed in the Indian constitution since 1948. It still happens, because people are people, but less so with each generation.
ramraj07 6y ago
It is also relatively very wrong to "determine" someone's cast by their looks. You can say you guessed it, but you should stop short of that probably.
- rudiv 6y ago
  Personally, I would engaging with the caste system for any purpose other than to destroy it is very wrong. I've seen plenty of upper-caste people assume someone's caste based on their appearance. They may have been wrong, but I fail to see how that is relevant, as I'm not justifying or explaining, just describing. If your particular objection is to the word 'determine', then I think we're getting hopelessly bogged down in semantics.
saagarjha 6y ago
Have you managed to figure out what kinds of things you do to pick out caste, or is it all subconscious? I ask because I have literally no idea how you’d tell; I’ll have to ask my parents (born and raised in India) if they can because if they do have that ability I’ve certainly never figured it out. Then again, the only reason I hear them talking about someone’s caste is if that person ran into issues because of it…

by rudiv 6y ago

paloaltokid 6y ago

> it is relatively easy to determine someone's general (varna) caste and specific (jati) caste from their familial name(s) and/or physical appearance. Is this because people from a specific caste tend to concentrate in a specific geographic region? I've learned as a Westerner that there's no model I've grown up with that's really the best for making sense of India as someone who wasn't born there. What makes the most sense to me is what an Indian colleague told me - "think of it as the United States of Europe -- that many languages, that much diversity, that much complexity and problems."

youeseh 6y ago
No, not geographic. Unlike ethnicity or color, the caste system is racial discrimination based on profession. In old Indian kingdoms, there were warriors, priests, teachers, business people, janitors etc. The caste system basically puts a social value on each of these with priests (who were also teachers) being at the top. The problem is, you couldn't just choose to be a priest.. or a warrior.. or a janitor. You were born into the profession. You were a janitor because your father was a janitor and his father before him. Discriminating based on caste for the purposes of education, work, government services, etc.. has been outlawed in the Indian constitution since 1948. It still happens, because people are people, but less so with each generation.

ramraj07 6y ago

It is also relatively very wrong to "determine" someone's cast by their looks. You can say you guessed it, but you should stop short of that probably.

rudiv 6y ago
Personally, I would engaging with the caste system for any purpose other than to destroy it is very wrong. I've seen plenty of upper-caste people assume someone's caste based on their appearance. They may have been wrong, but I fail to see how that is relevant, as I'm not justifying or explaining, just describing. If your particular objection is to the word 'determine', then I think we're getting hopelessly bogged down in semantics.

saagarjha 6y ago

Have you managed to figure out what kinds of things you do to pick out caste, or is it all subconscious? I ask because I have literally no idea how you’d tell; I’ll have to ask my parents (born and raised in India) if they can because if they do have that ability I’ve certainly never figured it out. Then again, the only reason I hear them talking about someone’s caste is if that person ran into issues because of it…