6 ms·

The US is an oppressive surveillance state with regular police murdering minorities, rampant white supremacy, and when not in the middle of catastrophically mis

by yoav 6y ago

The US is an oppressive surveillance state with regular police murdering minorities, rampant white supremacy, and when not in the middle of catastrophically mishandling a pandemic, has a mass shooting every day of the year. To most people outside the US’s branding sway there’s very little difference between a USA and a Russia or China

almost_usual 6y ago
Also a country where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities. Will outright challenge authority in the street and march until negotiations are made during a pandemic. This does not happen in China or Russia.
- Barrin92 6y ago
  >where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities but mostly to act it out as performance art because people have been marching for decades now and yet here we are. The US is the only country that kind of lives in a permanent television version of itself, with people setting trashcans on fire for justice or throwing a window in, while a few dozen journalists capture some very authentic images[1] People in Russia or China are realistic enough to know that this is in itself nothing but entertainment. The US is in a sense the most advanced security state on the planet, because pretty much nobody else has manged to internalize its own opposition to that degree. [1]https://i.redd.it/xqrhsj17wb321.jpg https://i.redd.it/xqrhsj17wb321.jpg
- yoav 6y ago
  Millions of people risking their lives to beg the government to stop murdering people and police engaging in widespread violent crackdown against those people demonstrating is exactly what happens in those countries. I don’t know how systematic police murder and beating up peaceful protestors looks different to you when it happens in the US and when it happens elsewhere. What is it about the anthem or flag that makes you see it differently? Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same. What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing. At least China and Russia consider healthcare a human right like any developed country. The US health care system is depraved.
  - yoav 6y ago
    Is the voter suppression that happens in the US, or the fact that the party with the least votes keeps getting into power because of an antiquated system that gives “former” slave states more power feel like democracy to you? Does the concentration camp network for refugees or muslim ban which was just extended to the end of the year feel different to China’s treatment of Uighurs to you? Why?
    - obiye27 6y ago
      Voter suppression. And you want to compare that to the single party systems of China or Russia? Why do problems with US democracy make you want to abandon it and wallow in misery, and pretend like there is no hope in the world? Why can’t you have a teaspoon of strength and recognize the US is so much closer to real democracy than either of those countries? It’s pathetic.
  - hkmaxpro 6y ago
    > Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same. > What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing. US’s reaction is hugely different than HK’s. Not a single HK cop was actually penalized, let alone fired or charged, for their misconducts during the year long protests. The only HK cop that was charged was the one who posted posters criticizing the police force. [1] By contrast, numerous US cops were fired and charged. Not to mention two weeks before George Floyd was killed, a South Asian was also killed by HK cops by kneeing on his neck. [2] The victim’s name wasn’t made public, not a single HK cop was penalized, and they went on to keep doing the same to HK protesters a month later (no casualty this time) [3]. Disbanding the HK police is one of the core demands of Hong Kong protesters [4]. While US has made some police reforms, nothing like this happened in Hong Kong, except HK police just got more powerful under the new National Security Law. And you tell me US is the same as HK? [1] http://www.rfi.fr/tw/%E6%94%BF%E6%B2%BB/20200118-%E4%BC%91%E7%8F%AD%E9%98%B2%E6%9A%B4%E8%AD%A6%E5%BF%83%E5%9C%A8%E6%BC%A2%E8%B2%BC%E9%80%A3%E5%84%82%E7%89%86%E8%AB%B7%E5%88%BA%E4%B8%80%E5%93%A5%E8%A2%AB%E6%8D%95 http://www.rfi.fr/tw/%E6%94%BF%E6%B2%BB/20200118-%E4%BC%91%E... (in Chinese) [2] https://www.hk01.com/%E7%AA%81%E7%99%BC/471390/%E9%9D%9E%E8%8F%AF%E8%A3%94%E9%86%89%E6%BC%A2%E9%81%AD%E8%AD%A6%E5%88%B6%E6%9C%8D%E7%BF%8C%E6%97%A5%E6%AD%BB%E4%BA%A1-%E6%B6%88%E9%98%B2-%E7%94%B7%E5%AD%90%E5%9C%A8%E8%AD%A6%E8%BB%8A%E5%85%A7%E5%B7%B2%E7%84%A1%E5%91%BC%E5%90%B8%E8%84%88%E6%90%8F https://www.hk01.com/%E7%AA%81%E7%99%BC/471390/%E9%9D%9E%E8%... (in Chinese) [3] https://hongkongfp.com/2020/06/15/i-couldnt-breathe-hong-kong-police-say-neck-restraint-used-during-arrest-of-schoolgirl-was-within-protocol/ https://hongkongfp.com/2020/06/15/i-couldnt-breathe-hong-kon... [4] https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/world/breakingnews/2925727 https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/world/breakingnews/2925727 (in Chinese)
creato 6y ago
Would you rather live in North Korea or South Korea? Hong Kong or Taiwan? West Germany or East Germany?
obiye 6y ago
Right. That’s why millions of people clamor every year to immigrate to Russia for a better life. Get a grip. The world is not black and white.
- freeone3000 6y ago
  Here's immigration stats for Russia: https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/immigration-statistics#:~:text=Russia%20immigration%20statistics%20for%202015,a%204.01%25%20increase%20from%202010.&text=Russia%20immigration%20statistics%20for%202005,a%200.24%25%20decline%20from%201995 https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/immigration.... Of course millions are clamoring to immigrate to Russia for a better life - it's a rich, stable country!
  - obiye27 6y ago
    So stable it has multiple ongoing civil conflicts. Come visit Russia, we didn’t shoot down any airliners this year!
    - fuoqi 6y ago
      Last civil conflict in Russia was the second Chechen war. By all definitions it's Ukraine in the state of civil war, not Russia. More than 90% of Donbas rebels are Ukrainian citizens. Russia of course supports the pro-Russian side in this conflict, but foreign interference during civil wars is so common, you could call it a rule. And even outside the war zone you can see a strong polarization in Ukrainian society (just look at the recent news about an attempted murder of an opposition party member by far-right nationalists), with nothing comparable in Russia.
      - obiye27 6y ago
        Ukraine is not in civil war, Ukraine was invaded. I hope you supported the Iraq war? What a terrible civil conflict we had to get involved in.
    - ric2b 6y ago
raverbashing 6y ago
Some people really need to step out of their bubble and go see what it really is out there. Not saying the US doesn't have problems, but this laundry list is mild for let's say 70% of the world's population. And to be fair the "woke" press (including some national "unbiased" news sources) just make the problem worse. But I guess the grass is always greener > To most people outside the US’s branding sway there’s very little difference between a USA and a Russia or China Only if they ignore how things happen on this countries or is sheltered. Now, about "mishandling a pandemic", yes, it could have been done better, but I think a lot of countries are not handling it better, they just didn't get the check yet and/or are putting the problem under the table.

by yoav 6y ago

almost_usual 6y ago

Also a country where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities. Will outright challenge authority in the street and march until negotiations are made during a pandemic. This does not happen in China or Russia.

Barrin92 6y ago
>where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities but mostly to act it out as performance art because people have been marching for decades now and yet here we are. The US is the only country that kind of lives in a permanent television version of itself, with people setting trashcans on fire for justice or throwing a window in, while a few dozen journalists capture some very authentic images[1] People in Russia or China are realistic enough to know that this is in itself nothing but entertainment. The US is in a sense the most advanced security state on the planet, because pretty much nobody else has manged to internalize its own opposition to that degree. [1]https://i.redd.it/xqrhsj17wb321.jpg https://i.redd.it/xqrhsj17wb321.jpg
yoav 6y ago
Millions of people risking their lives to beg the government to stop murdering people and police engaging in widespread violent crackdown against those people demonstrating is exactly what happens in those countries. I don’t know how systematic police murder and beating up peaceful protestors looks different to you when it happens in the US and when it happens elsewhere. What is it about the anthem or flag that makes you see it differently? Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same. What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing. At least China and Russia consider healthcare a human right like any developed country. The US health care system is depraved.
- yoav 6y ago
  Is the voter suppression that happens in the US, or the fact that the party with the least votes keeps getting into power because of an antiquated system that gives “former” slave states more power feel like democracy to you? Does the concentration camp network for refugees or muslim ban which was just extended to the end of the year feel different to China’s treatment of Uighurs to you? Why?
  - obiye27 6y ago
    Voter suppression. And you want to compare that to the single party systems of China or Russia? Why do problems with US democracy make you want to abandon it and wallow in misery, and pretend like there is no hope in the world? Why can’t you have a teaspoon of strength and recognize the US is so much closer to real democracy than either of those countries? It’s pathetic.
- hkmaxpro 6y ago
  > Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same. > What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing. US’s reaction is hugely different than HK’s. Not a single HK cop was actually penalized, let alone fired or charged, for their misconducts during the year long protests. The only HK cop that was charged was the one who posted posters criticizing the police force. [1] By contrast, numerous US cops were fired and charged. Not to mention two weeks before George Floyd was killed, a South Asian was also killed by HK cops by kneeing on his neck. [2] The victim’s name wasn’t made public, not a single HK cop was penalized, and they went on to keep doing the same to HK protesters a month later (no casualty this time) [3]. Disbanding the HK police is one of the core demands of Hong Kong protesters [4]. While US has made some police reforms, nothing like this happened in Hong Kong, except HK police just got more powerful under the new National Security Law. And you tell me US is the same as HK? [1] http://www.rfi.fr/tw/%E6%94%BF%E6%B2%BB/20200118-%E4%BC%91%E7%8F%AD%E9%98%B2%E6%9A%B4%E8%AD%A6%E5%BF%83%E5%9C%A8%E6%BC%A2%E8%B2%BC%E9%80%A3%E5%84%82%E7%89%86%E8%AB%B7%E5%88%BA%E4%B8%80%E5%93%A5%E8%A2%AB%E6%8D%95 http://www.rfi.fr/tw/%E6%94%BF%E6%B2%BB/20200118-%E4%BC%91%E... (in Chinese) [2] https://www.hk01.com/%E7%AA%81%E7%99%BC/471390/%E9%9D%9E%E8%8F%AF%E8%A3%94%E9%86%89%E6%BC%A2%E9%81%AD%E8%AD%A6%E5%88%B6%E6%9C%8D%E7%BF%8C%E6%97%A5%E6%AD%BB%E4%BA%A1-%E6%B6%88%E9%98%B2-%E7%94%B7%E5%AD%90%E5%9C%A8%E8%AD%A6%E8%BB%8A%E5%85%A7%E5%B7%B2%E7%84%A1%E5%91%BC%E5%90%B8%E8%84%88%E6%90%8F https://www.hk01.com/%E7%AA%81%E7%99%BC/471390/%E9%9D%9E%E8%... (in Chinese) [3] https://hongkongfp.com/2020/06/15/i-couldnt-breathe-hong-kong-police-say-neck-restraint-used-during-arrest-of-schoolgirl-was-within-protocol/ https://hongkongfp.com/2020/06/15/i-couldnt-breathe-hong-kon... [4] https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/world/breakingnews/2925727 https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/world/breakingnews/2925727 (in Chinese)

creato 6y ago

Would you rather live in North Korea or South Korea? Hong Kong or Taiwan? West Germany or East Germany?

obiye 6y ago

Right. That’s why millions of people clamor every year to immigrate to Russia for a better life. Get a grip. The world is not black and white.

freeone3000 6y ago
Here's immigration stats for Russia: https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/immigration-statistics#:~:text=Russia%20immigration%20statistics%20for%202015,a%204.01%25%20increase%20from%202010.&text=Russia%20immigration%20statistics%20for%202005,a%200.24%25%20decline%20from%201995 https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/immigration.... Of course millions are clamoring to immigrate to Russia for a better life - it's a rich, stable country!
- obiye27 6y ago
  So stable it has multiple ongoing civil conflicts. Come visit Russia, we didn’t shoot down any airliners this year!
  - fuoqi 6y ago
    Last civil conflict in Russia was the second Chechen war. By all definitions it's Ukraine in the state of civil war, not Russia. More than 90% of Donbas rebels are Ukrainian citizens. Russia of course supports the pro-Russian side in this conflict, but foreign interference during civil wars is so common, you could call it a rule. And even outside the war zone you can see a strong polarization in Ukrainian society (just look at the recent news about an attempted murder of an opposition party member by far-right nationalists), with nothing comparable in Russia.
    - obiye27 6y ago
      Ukraine is not in civil war, Ukraine was invaded. I hope you supported the Iraq war? What a terrible civil conflict we had to get involved in.
  - ric2b 6y ago

raverbashing 6y ago

Some people really need to step out of their bubble and go see what it really is out there. Not saying the US doesn't have problems, but this laundry list is mild for let's say 70% of the world's population. And to be fair the "woke" press (including some national "unbiased" news sources) just make the problem worse. But I guess the grass is always greener > To most people outside the US’s branding sway there’s very little difference between a USA and a Russia or China Only if they ignore how things happen on this countries or is sheltered. Now, about "mishandling a pandemic", yes, it could have been done better, but I think a lot of countries are not handling it better, they just didn't get the check yet and/or are putting the problem under the table.