6 ms·

If people didn't spend money they don't have the problem you describe dissolves. No one has to use credit cards and being financially literate is an individual

If people didn't spend money they don't have the problem you describe dissolves. No one has to use credit cards and being financially literate is an individual responsibility.

dimitrios1 6y ago
You mean to tell me all my woes in life aren't some form or another someone else's fault?
komali2 6y ago
> financially literate is an individual responsibility. Is being able to read and write an "individual responsibility?" How about the ability to communicate in a language at all? What about any other basic core skill that would make a person capable of learning more things to make them "productive?" "Individual responsibility" as it pertains to these topics is at best a misnomer, if it even names an existent thing at all. Surely you don't think it's ok for, say, a Company Town to exist? Can you extrapolate from there why it's not ok for credit card companies to bamboozle less educated Americans for money?
- notyourwork 6y ago
  I would encourage you to frame your disagreement with statements and facts. Asking questions expecting the reader to draw the same conclusion as you isn't a useful discussion mechanism. Especially when the reader doesn't agree with you.
  - komali2 6y ago
    I'm not sure what the relevant facts would be around an extremely value based argument of who is responsible for educating a society. I guess we could look at the general fact that education is one of the better investments to increase a nation's GDP, bit I'm more concerned with the ethics than the money.
  - pirocks 6y ago
    Here are some facts: https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp#3 https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp#3 , about 14% of adults in the US in 2003 had little to no reading skills.
- lucaspm98 6y ago
  Yes, I realize you’re not being genuine, but those are all your responsibility to do/learn. Although everything you mentioned is what you should learn as a child, so we have a moral/social code for parents and the community along with some help from schools to teach these basic principles. I could follow your argument if the card issuers weren’t transparent in their pricing and terms like payday loan companies. However, the interest rates are laid out very clearly several times as you apply and are approved as regulations demand. I’m all for education but at some point you have to let people do what they want with their money.
  - komali2 6y ago
    I am being genuine. I'm not sure the country has taken the necessary step up in early education to even have the population have a baseline understanding of what interest rate is. I didn't learn that anywhere in elementary, middle, or high school. I had to figure it out on my own. I don't think that's acceptable. I think that leaves our population vulnerable to predatory companies, who have a disproportionate ability to lobby the government to allow them to stay predatory. I envision a capitalist hellscape where the population is kept purposefully reapable.
TylerE 6y ago
The actually financially literate know how much more buyer protection you get with a CC than with any other form of payment.
- dingaling 6y ago
  And why is that? It's a beautiful example of regulatory capture that led to credit cards gaining advantage over other payment methods. Such protections should either be scrapped or extended to cover all methods.
  - perryizgr8 6y ago
    > Such protections should either be scrapped or extended to cover all methods. You are free to invent a payment method and provide all these protections to your customers. Why would you want to remove protections that CC companies are providing to their users?
kneel 6y ago
If companies weren't allowed to offer predatory lending towards financially illiterate the problem you describe dissolves, this is actually much easier to implement than individual responsibility.
- vasco 6y ago
  Ah yes, the old "let's block stupid (poor) people from accessing financial instruments for their own good" argument while at the same time having legal gambling.
  - jackson1442 6y ago
    predatory lending != lending. Predatory lending generally refers to companies like payday loan companies and cash advance companies which feed off of forcing people to continuously borrow until they can't borrow any more. Lending should absolutely be accessible to everyone in some way or another, especially in a world where a transmission failure can lead to a lost job if you can't afford to fix it right away.
    - throwaway98797 6y ago
      It’s predatory the moment it feels too high to you.
  - stale2002 6y ago
    Hey, if you want to argue that gambling should be more restricted, then go ahead. It is highly restricted in many places.

If people didn't spend money they don't have the problem you describe dissolves. No one has to use credit cards and being financially literate is an individual responsibility.

dimitrios1 6y ago

You mean to tell me all my woes in life aren't some form or another someone else's fault?

komali2 6y ago

> financially literate is an individual responsibility. Is being able to read and write an "individual responsibility?" How about the ability to communicate in a language at all? What about any other basic core skill that would make a person capable of learning more things to make them "productive?" "Individual responsibility" as it pertains to these topics is at best a misnomer, if it even names an existent thing at all. Surely you don't think it's ok for, say, a Company Town to exist? Can you extrapolate from there why it's not ok for credit card companies to bamboozle less educated Americans for money?

notyourwork 6y ago
I would encourage you to frame your disagreement with statements and facts. Asking questions expecting the reader to draw the same conclusion as you isn't a useful discussion mechanism. Especially when the reader doesn't agree with you.
- komali2 6y ago
  I'm not sure what the relevant facts would be around an extremely value based argument of who is responsible for educating a society. I guess we could look at the general fact that education is one of the better investments to increase a nation's GDP, bit I'm more concerned with the ethics than the money.
- pirocks 6y ago
  Here are some facts: https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp#3 https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp#3 , about 14% of adults in the US in 2003 had little to no reading skills.
lucaspm98 6y ago
Yes, I realize you’re not being genuine, but those are all your responsibility to do/learn. Although everything you mentioned is what you should learn as a child, so we have a moral/social code for parents and the community along with some help from schools to teach these basic principles. I could follow your argument if the card issuers weren’t transparent in their pricing and terms like payday loan companies. However, the interest rates are laid out very clearly several times as you apply and are approved as regulations demand. I’m all for education but at some point you have to let people do what they want with their money.
- komali2 6y ago
  I am being genuine. I'm not sure the country has taken the necessary step up in early education to even have the population have a baseline understanding of what interest rate is. I didn't learn that anywhere in elementary, middle, or high school. I had to figure it out on my own. I don't think that's acceptable. I think that leaves our population vulnerable to predatory companies, who have a disproportionate ability to lobby the government to allow them to stay predatory. I envision a capitalist hellscape where the population is kept purposefully reapable.

TylerE 6y ago

The actually financially literate know how much more buyer protection you get with a CC than with any other form of payment.

dingaling 6y ago
And why is that? It's a beautiful example of regulatory capture that led to credit cards gaining advantage over other payment methods. Such protections should either be scrapped or extended to cover all methods.
- perryizgr8 6y ago
  > Such protections should either be scrapped or extended to cover all methods. You are free to invent a payment method and provide all these protections to your customers. Why would you want to remove protections that CC companies are providing to their users?

kneel 6y ago

If companies weren't allowed to offer predatory lending towards financially illiterate the problem you describe dissolves, this is actually much easier to implement than individual responsibility.

vasco 6y ago
Ah yes, the old "let's block stupid (poor) people from accessing financial instruments for their own good" argument while at the same time having legal gambling.
- jackson1442 6y ago
  predatory lending != lending. Predatory lending generally refers to companies like payday loan companies and cash advance companies which feed off of forcing people to continuously borrow until they can't borrow any more. Lending should absolutely be accessible to everyone in some way or another, especially in a world where a transmission failure can lead to a lost job if you can't afford to fix it right away.
  - throwaway98797 6y ago
    It’s predatory the moment it feels too high to you.
- stale2002 6y ago
  Hey, if you want to argue that gambling should be more restricted, then go ahead. It is highly restricted in many places.