4 ms·

But since the retailers can't offer discounts for cash transactions, people who pay with cash are being over charged and subsidizing those fees.

anamexis 6y ago
Retailers can offer discounts for cash transactions, per the Durbin Amendment to the Dodd-Frank bill of 2010. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durbin_amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durbin_amendment
- hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
  It depends on where you live. 10 states have laws that prohibit or restrict discounts for cash transactions: California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Kansas, Maine, Massachusetts, New York, Oklahoma and Texas. Some of those restrictions have been invalidated by federal courts, but I was somewhat confused about which states were affected.
  - komali2 6y ago
    Weird, because in three of those states (New York, Texas, and California) I have used cash to get a cash discount in the last year. I imagine it's because of lack of enforcement?
    - hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
      All three of those states I believe had their surcharge bans invalidated by federal courts. Texas' law was declared unconstitutional in summer 2018: https://faq.sll.texas.gov/questions/9631 https://faq.sll.texas.gov/questions/9631
  - just-ok 6y ago
    I have definitely personally seen many instances in which you get a discount paying in cash in California. Maybe they get away with it because they technically frame it as charging extra for paying with a card?
  - BenjiWiebe 6y ago
    Perhaps this is explicitly allowed (you did say restrictions) but in Kansas it isn't uncommon to see gas station signs displaying a cash price and a card price.
StillBored 6y ago
Well, after trying to negotiate cash discounts ~25 years ago on a couple fairly significant purchases for me (furniture) I gave up and joined them... By carrying a discover card, which at the time was just about the only cash back card in existence (the only one I knew about). So, I still favor the discover (despite now being part of Morgan Stanly?) for most purchases, but when its rejected I fall back on a MC with a cashback program. That program pays for my computer hardware...
hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
That really depends on where you live. It seems pretty confusing because (a) federal law made surcharges for using a card legal under a 2013 settlement with Visa and MC, and (b) there have been a bunch of federal court cases, including a 2017 Supreme Court case, that invalidated some state laws that prohibited surcharges. Interestingly, even now that many merchants are allowed to offer a discount for using cash, most don't because they've likely figured out (a) if they lose just 1 sale in 30 it's likely a net negative for them, plus (b) people are likely to spend more, especially on impulse purchases, when using a card, and (c) there is just a sense that it can be annoying to customers to have to pay more for using a card, taking away from customer goodwill.
briandear 6y ago
> But since the retailers can't offer discounts for cash transactions Citation needed.

anamexis 6y ago

Retailers can offer discounts for cash transactions, per the Durbin Amendment to the Dodd-Frank bill of 2010. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durbin_amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durbin_amendment

hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
It depends on where you live. 10 states have laws that prohibit or restrict discounts for cash transactions: California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Kansas, Maine, Massachusetts, New York, Oklahoma and Texas. Some of those restrictions have been invalidated by federal courts, but I was somewhat confused about which states were affected.
- komali2 6y ago
  Weird, because in three of those states (New York, Texas, and California) I have used cash to get a cash discount in the last year. I imagine it's because of lack of enforcement?
  - hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
    All three of those states I believe had their surcharge bans invalidated by federal courts. Texas' law was declared unconstitutional in summer 2018: https://faq.sll.texas.gov/questions/9631 https://faq.sll.texas.gov/questions/9631
- just-ok 6y ago
  I have definitely personally seen many instances in which you get a discount paying in cash in California. Maybe they get away with it because they technically frame it as charging extra for paying with a card?
- BenjiWiebe 6y ago
  Perhaps this is explicitly allowed (you did say restrictions) but in Kansas it isn't uncommon to see gas station signs displaying a cash price and a card price.

StillBored 6y ago

Well, after trying to negotiate cash discounts ~25 years ago on a couple fairly significant purchases for me (furniture) I gave up and joined them... By carrying a discover card, which at the time was just about the only cash back card in existence (the only one I knew about). So, I still favor the discover (despite now being part of Morgan Stanly?) for most purchases, but when its rejected I fall back on a MC with a cashback program. That program pays for my computer hardware...

hn_throwaway_99 6y ago

That really depends on where you live. It seems pretty confusing because (a) federal law made surcharges for using a card legal under a 2013 settlement with Visa and MC, and (b) there have been a bunch of federal court cases, including a 2017 Supreme Court case, that invalidated some state laws that prohibited surcharges. Interestingly, even now that many merchants are allowed to offer a discount for using cash, most don't because they've likely figured out (a) if they lose just 1 sale in 30 it's likely a net negative for them, plus (b) people are likely to spend more, especially on impulse purchases, when using a card, and (c) there is just a sense that it can be annoying to customers to have to pay more for using a card, taking away from customer goodwill.

briandear 6y ago

> But since the retailers can't offer discounts for cash transactions Citation needed.