4 ms·

> You are missing the forest for the trees here - and I imagine that's by choice. To flip this around, I'd say you're fascinated by the forest when someone els

by IanCal 6y ago

> You are missing the forest for the trees here - and I imagine that's by choice. To flip this around, I'd say you're fascinated by the forest when someone else just needs a tree. I understand the excitement and the freedom you're describing. What I think you're missing is that if others don't see a need for what you're describing it not only doesn't sound useful but sounds like the tool is definitely not aimed at them. This is not them being deliberately obstinate. In the classic spirit of tortuous car analogies for technology - there is a benefit in having a car you are able to maintain yourself. But when asked why this car and not another if the examples all sound like "You could add six steering wheels and put a tyre on top and have the horn play jingle bells only on christmas if you wanted!" then it immediately puts people off.

AJRF 6y ago
Sorry but I entirely disagree with you here given the context - I am answering the question "Is there something substantial that Sublime users are missing?". What I described is a substantial benefit of using emacs over sublime text. If you are a programmer there are many benefits to total control over a system, and the ability to compose new functionality from a solid foundation of base functions. Now, you could happily use emacs forever without ever using that control, but the difference is with something like Sublime control you don't even have the freedom to make the choice as to whether you want to or not. It's out of your control, which is a downside when compared to emacs. The OP wasn't asking why would anyone want control they were asking what are the benefits of emacs in comparison to sublime.
- IanCal 6y ago
  > What I described is a substantial benefit of using emacs over sublime text. I think you're _assuming_ "more control" is a substantial benefit for them. > The OP wasn't asking why would anyone want control they were asking what are the benefits of emacs in comparison to sublime. Right, but if you don't see a strong use case for that control it isn't a benefit. The examples you gave were of changing the UI in a way I am not interested and a way of triggering emails and slack messages when I save a file which would be actively harmful. Giving me the ability to do something I do not want to do is not beneficial. It's like telling me a car is better because it's so modifiable I can install a Margaritaville. That would be a bad change to me so it's not selling me on the benefit of this car.
  - blindluke 6y ago
    > Giving me the ability to do something I do not want to do is not beneficial. Expecting that an example should be tailor-made is not very beneficial, either. When I go out to buy a car, and the salesman tells me the trunk is big enough to fit a grown pig, this information is of use to me. Not because I smuggle livestock, but because this gives me a good idea of what the capacity is.
    - IanCal 6y ago
      I'm not expecting a tailor made example, but as you say one that I can compare to my own situation. Obvious things would be like vims make command - I'm not going to turn around and say a webpack example isn't relevant because I'm a python guy as I can see a direct parallel. But lots of this is standard and in major ides, or well written and tested plugins are available. Saying I can send emails on a file save is not that useful as I can't see any reason I'd want to do that. I'd definitely not want to throw together a regulatory setup - that should not be something solved there (margharitaville comparison). Broadly - it's not necessarily that the rest of us are missing some incredible wonderous world because we're too blind to see. It may simply be that the freedoms afforded are of little value to us. Edit - I think I've got it sorted in my head why I don't care as much about this. My problems are typically shared by lots of other people, and so solutions that suit me are readily available. I don't enjoy building my tools as much as I enjoy solving other problems with them. It's the same reason I got rid of my mythtv setup and just bought something that worked to play videos. It was less flexible but did what I actually wanted better than my own setup and didn't require me to build and maintain it.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]

by IanCal 6y ago

AJRF 6y ago

Sorry but I entirely disagree with you here given the context - I am answering the question "Is there something substantial that Sublime users are missing?". What I described is a substantial benefit of using emacs over sublime text. If you are a programmer there are many benefits to total control over a system, and the ability to compose new functionality from a solid foundation of base functions. Now, you could happily use emacs forever without ever using that control, but the difference is with something like Sublime control you don't even have the freedom to make the choice as to whether you want to or not. It's out of your control, which is a downside when compared to emacs. The OP wasn't asking why would anyone want control they were asking what are the benefits of emacs in comparison to sublime.

IanCal 6y ago
> What I described is a substantial benefit of using emacs over sublime text. I think you're _assuming_ "more control" is a substantial benefit for them. > The OP wasn't asking why would anyone want control they were asking what are the benefits of emacs in comparison to sublime. Right, but if you don't see a strong use case for that control it isn't a benefit. The examples you gave were of changing the UI in a way I am not interested and a way of triggering emails and slack messages when I save a file which would be actively harmful. Giving me the ability to do something I do not want to do is not beneficial. It's like telling me a car is better because it's so modifiable I can install a Margaritaville. That would be a bad change to me so it's not selling me on the benefit of this car.
- blindluke 6y ago
  > Giving me the ability to do something I do not want to do is not beneficial. Expecting that an example should be tailor-made is not very beneficial, either. When I go out to buy a car, and the salesman tells me the trunk is big enough to fit a grown pig, this information is of use to me. Not because I smuggle livestock, but because this gives me a good idea of what the capacity is.
  - IanCal 6y ago
    I'm not expecting a tailor made example, but as you say one that I can compare to my own situation. Obvious things would be like vims make command - I'm not going to turn around and say a webpack example isn't relevant because I'm a python guy as I can see a direct parallel. But lots of this is standard and in major ides, or well written and tested plugins are available. Saying I can send emails on a file save is not that useful as I can't see any reason I'd want to do that. I'd definitely not want to throw together a regulatory setup - that should not be something solved there (margharitaville comparison). Broadly - it's not necessarily that the rest of us are missing some incredible wonderous world because we're too blind to see. It may simply be that the freedoms afforded are of little value to us. Edit - I think I've got it sorted in my head why I don't care as much about this. My problems are typically shared by lots of other people, and so solutions that suit me are readily available. I don't enjoy building my tools as much as I enjoy solving other problems with them. It's the same reason I got rid of my mythtv setup and just bought something that worked to play videos. It was less flexible but did what I actually wanted better than my own setup and didn't require me to build and maintain it.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]