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>NY is the only state that really saw the full potential impact That's because of practices like dumping patients with COVID into nursing homes full of healthy

by 0xy 6y ago

>NY is the only state that really saw the full potential impact That's because of practices like dumping patients with COVID into nursing homes full of healthy elderly people. NYC was notorious for this, and that's why nearly half of all COVID deaths in the US were in nursing homes. >Now US states reopened and cases are growing exponentially again and deaths will follow This is a guess, but it ignores the dramatically different testing criteria. Now tests are available everywhere easily to practically anyone who wants one. At the "peak" there was huge constraints on testing kits (so only the sickest possible people got them). It also remains to be seen that lockdowns don't cause more deaths via economic destruction (poverty is directly linked to mortality) than COVID. So it is absolutely not established to say lockdowns are beneficial for health reasons.

darkerside 6y ago
If it's just testing, why are hospitalizations up dramatically? I keep hearing the poverty argument and it seems baseless to me. Nothing is 100%, so I acknowledge all of these scenarios are hypothetical. Still, we're trading deaths that are very hypothetical for deaths that we understand relatively well. If you're really concerned about the poor, why not lead with solutions for that (e.g. increase funding for food banks, homeless shelters, and school lunches), instead of just tearing down solutions for COVID?
- 0xy 6y ago
  Are you saying you don't believe poverty has a direct link to mortality? That's been repeatedly proven across a wide range of different sources. http://news.mit.edu/2016/study-rich-poor-huge-mortality-gap-us-0411 http://news.mit.edu/2016/study-rich-poor-huge-mortality-gap-... Or are you saying that forcing businesses to close leading to layoffs, bankruptcies and foreclosures (which has already begun) don't cause poverty? The scientists recommending lockdowns totally disregard these facts, among other health impacts of being forced to stay home (mental and physical).
  - darkerside 6y ago
    No, I'm saying that you've presented a false dichotomy, that we should be solving the COVID problem, and that if you think the solution needs to be amended or extended in ways that mitigate associated poverty-based mortality, you should present those amendments instead of treating the issue as a reason to do nothing.
take_a_breath 6y ago
==It also remains to be seen that lockdowns don't cause more deaths via economic destruction (poverty is directly linked to mortality) than COVID.== Curiously, what data would you need in order to determine which causes more deaths?
grey-area 6y ago
NY made mistakes, the federal government has made worse mistakes and other states have compounded them.

by 0xy 6y ago

darkerside 6y ago

If it's just testing, why are hospitalizations up dramatically? I keep hearing the poverty argument and it seems baseless to me. Nothing is 100%, so I acknowledge all of these scenarios are hypothetical. Still, we're trading deaths that are very hypothetical for deaths that we understand relatively well. If you're really concerned about the poor, why not lead with solutions for that (e.g. increase funding for food banks, homeless shelters, and school lunches), instead of just tearing down solutions for COVID?

0xy 6y ago
Are you saying you don't believe poverty has a direct link to mortality? That's been repeatedly proven across a wide range of different sources. http://news.mit.edu/2016/study-rich-poor-huge-mortality-gap-us-0411 http://news.mit.edu/2016/study-rich-poor-huge-mortality-gap-... Or are you saying that forcing businesses to close leading to layoffs, bankruptcies and foreclosures (which has already begun) don't cause poverty? The scientists recommending lockdowns totally disregard these facts, among other health impacts of being forced to stay home (mental and physical).
- darkerside 6y ago
  No, I'm saying that you've presented a false dichotomy, that we should be solving the COVID problem, and that if you think the solution needs to be amended or extended in ways that mitigate associated poverty-based mortality, you should present those amendments instead of treating the issue as a reason to do nothing.

take_a_breath 6y ago

==It also remains to be seen that lockdowns don't cause more deaths via economic destruction (poverty is directly linked to mortality) than COVID.== Curiously, what data would you need in order to determine which causes more deaths?

grey-area 6y ago

NY made mistakes, the federal government has made worse mistakes and other states have compounded them.