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Would you accept "trust in the media" as one such measure of decline? If so here: https://news.gallup.com/poll/243665/media-trust-continues-recover-2016-low.asp

Would you accept "trust in the media" as one such measure of decline? If so here: https://news.gallup.com/poll/243665/media-trust-continues-recover-2016-low.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/243665/media-trust-continues-re... Maybe we can get past that issue though. I understand your point to be that Journalism was never credible and that therefore we are not really any worse off than we have ever been. I disagree, but maybe it does not matter all that much, my main point is that more than ever we desperately need something like good Journalism, whether good Journalism ever existed or not. Information has been weaponized before, sure, but the volume, sophistication, low cost and precision of the manipulation is unprecedented. The difference in degree is so great that it has become a difference of kind and the only defense we have at the moment is cynicism. As to people paying for proper Journalism, we also used to say no one would pay for electric cars or for music. Maybe we just need better products.

ativzzz 6y ago
Interesting article, and of course we don't know the reason for decrease in trust. Is it because the media is lying more, or because the people have better access to information and thus are realizing the lies of the media? That's probably impossible to measure. And interesting that > Democrats' Trust in Media Highest in Past 20 Years While Republican has gone down. I wonder how much effect Donald Trump saying "Fake news" on Twitter all the time has on people's perception, versus what they would think if he wasn't saying that.
- zarkov99 6y ago
  > Democrats' Trust in Media Highest in Past 20 Years Confirmation bias is a real thing.
BeetleB 6y ago
> Would you accept "trust in the media" as one such measure of decline? No I wouldn't. The whole gist of my comments is that increased distrust is a good thing. That it led to all kinds of factions trusting there own version of nonsense is sad, but the fact that they don't blindly trust news outlets is good. > As to people paying for proper Journalism, we also used to say no one would pay for electric cars or for music. Maybe we just need better products. The difference being that people did pay for journalism, and no longer do. 30 years ago, you would likely have had at least one subscription to a newspaper - often two (one local and one national). Today, the number of people who have such subscriptions has dropped to half what it was (I'm surprised it is still this high).

ativzzz 6y ago

Interesting article, and of course we don't know the reason for decrease in trust. Is it because the media is lying more, or because the people have better access to information and thus are realizing the lies of the media? That's probably impossible to measure. And interesting that > Democrats' Trust in Media Highest in Past 20 Years While Republican has gone down. I wonder how much effect Donald Trump saying "Fake news" on Twitter all the time has on people's perception, versus what they would think if he wasn't saying that.

zarkov99 6y ago
> Democrats' Trust in Media Highest in Past 20 Years Confirmation bias is a real thing.

BeetleB 6y ago

> Would you accept "trust in the media" as one such measure of decline? No I wouldn't. The whole gist of my comments is that increased distrust is a good thing. That it led to all kinds of factions trusting there own version of nonsense is sad, but the fact that they don't blindly trust news outlets is good. > As to people paying for proper Journalism, we also used to say no one would pay for electric cars or for music. Maybe we just need better products. The difference being that people did pay for journalism, and no longer do. 30 years ago, you would likely have had at least one subscription to a newspaper - often two (one local and one national). Today, the number of people who have such subscriptions has dropped to half what it was (I'm surprised it is still this high).