6 ms·

It's an interesting article, but the essential information is buried in the middle: In my experience, it’s only when I get on an editorial playlist that my son

It's an interesting article, but the essential information is buried in the middle: In my experience, it’s only when I get on an editorial playlist that my songs get heavily featured on algorithmic playlists like Discover Weekly. So how do you get on editorial playlists? I sincerely have no clue. I've been on editorial playlists 16 times but I have no idea how to replicate that. I find that this is true of many of these "I made X dollars per month doing Y!" articles: somewhere in the chain of events, there is a fateful intervention out of the control of the author that propels them to a higher tier of income than their peers who are otherwise following the same procedures.

jv22222 6y ago
Agree, serendipity is the hardest thing to reverse engineer.
wilshire_nc 6y ago
yep, if this were reproducible, we wouldn't be reading about it in a blog.
hammock 6y ago
Great point. And speaking from insider knowledge, I can tell you that there are consultants you can pay anywhere from a little bit up to thousands per month who will get you tested/placed on different editorial playlists. The more you can get on, and the longer you can stay on them (there is no guarantee of staying on, they only keep you on if you gain traction), the more success you will have.
- rorykoehler 6y ago
  Tom Misch used those for sure. I was only talking about it with my wife the other day. Lost in Paris seems to play evry time I open Spotify. I wish you could blacklist songs on Spotify.
  - tomerv 6y ago
    I'm pretty sure that Spotify has this button. It depends on the interface you're using, but it generally looks like a "no entrance" road sign. I used it a few times, and I didn't hear the song again.
    - rorykoehler 6y ago
      I only have a heart button. MacOS
- kossae 6y ago
  Is this still true? > We want to make something crystal clear: no one can pay to be added to one of Spotify’s editorial playlists. Our editors pick tracks with listeners in mind. They make these decisions using data about what’s resonating most with their community of listeners. https://artists.spotify.com/blog/share-new-music-for-playlist-consideration https://artists.spotify.com/blog/share-new-music-for-playlis...
  - hammock 6y ago
    Is that still the official policy? Yes. Is that what happens in practice? No. If you want it from a source other than me: "Inside the Black Market for Spotify Playlists" https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/spotify-playlist-black-market/ https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/spotify-playlist-black-mar...
virgilp 6y ago
I mean, it's the same thing with startup advice. "We did X, Y, Z. Oh and we also got lucky". It's not that X, Y, Z is necessarily bad advice, just that obviously nobody really knows how to be successful with anything. The closest you get is to know things that improve/decrease your odds.
m3kw9 6y ago
A bit of luck is always needed
VBprogrammer 6y ago
Another thing I found interesting is that he earns $800 / month from a total of about 3 million listens. I wonder how this compares to the royalties from a radio play from a popular local radio station? Comparatively, my dad has a moderately successful youtube channel, his most popular video has 18m views, and the next 3m. He has 66k subscribers. In an average month he'd earn ~£300 or so. Though usually quite a lot more around Christmas.
- CobrastanJorji 6y ago
  For the radio, in the US, artists are not paid a cent. Only the songwriters and publishers are paid.
  - rewgs 6y ago
    True, but an indie artist is nearly always the songwriter and publisher (no one else owns the publishing rights, hence “independent”). So it’s a fair comparison, and unfortunately, all else being equal, streaming woefully underperforms to radio to the point of tears.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - zdragnar 6y ago
      Maybe it is different in other areas of the country, but even in the nearby metro area, there are at most two or three "indie" stations (that is being generous, since I can only think of one) not counting the university stations that have virtually zero physical reach. Streaming might not pay much, but at least it is possible to be heard at all I suppose.
      - rewgs 6y ago
        What do you mean by the term “indie” here? Are the stations themselves not affiliated with larger corporations? Or are they mainly playing independent artists? Or both? I’m a professional musician and categorically reject the “but at least it is possible to be heard at all” angle. No. That is bullshit. Spotify is replacing BOTH album sales and radio play, and yet it pays multiple orders of magnitude worse than either.
TheSoftwareGuy 6y ago
I’ve noticed this too. The title has an air of “this is how you can pull yourself up by the bootstraps” feeling that turns into a “just takeover your dads company” when you read the article
JavaOffScript 6y ago
> I've been on editorial playlists 16 times but I have no idea how to replicate that. I do. Track down whoever at spotify controls those playlists and offer them money. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payola https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payola

jv22222 6y ago

Agree, serendipity is the hardest thing to reverse engineer.

wilshire_nc 6y ago

yep, if this were reproducible, we wouldn't be reading about it in a blog.

hammock 6y ago

Great point. And speaking from insider knowledge, I can tell you that there are consultants you can pay anywhere from a little bit up to thousands per month who will get you tested/placed on different editorial playlists. The more you can get on, and the longer you can stay on them (there is no guarantee of staying on, they only keep you on if you gain traction), the more success you will have.

rorykoehler 6y ago
Tom Misch used those for sure. I was only talking about it with my wife the other day. Lost in Paris seems to play evry time I open Spotify. I wish you could blacklist songs on Spotify.
- tomerv 6y ago
  I'm pretty sure that Spotify has this button. It depends on the interface you're using, but it generally looks like a "no entrance" road sign. I used it a few times, and I didn't hear the song again.
  - rorykoehler 6y ago
    I only have a heart button. MacOS
kossae 6y ago
Is this still true? > We want to make something crystal clear: no one can pay to be added to one of Spotify’s editorial playlists. Our editors pick tracks with listeners in mind. They make these decisions using data about what’s resonating most with their community of listeners. https://artists.spotify.com/blog/share-new-music-for-playlist-consideration https://artists.spotify.com/blog/share-new-music-for-playlis...
- hammock 6y ago
  Is that still the official policy? Yes. Is that what happens in practice? No. If you want it from a source other than me: "Inside the Black Market for Spotify Playlists" https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/spotify-playlist-black-market/ https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/spotify-playlist-black-mar...

virgilp 6y ago

I mean, it's the same thing with startup advice. "We did X, Y, Z. Oh and we also got lucky". It's not that X, Y, Z is necessarily bad advice, just that obviously nobody really knows how to be successful with anything. The closest you get is to know things that improve/decrease your odds.

m3kw9 6y ago

A bit of luck is always needed

VBprogrammer 6y ago

Another thing I found interesting is that he earns $800 / month from a total of about 3 million listens. I wonder how this compares to the royalties from a radio play from a popular local radio station? Comparatively, my dad has a moderately successful youtube channel, his most popular video has 18m views, and the next 3m. He has 66k subscribers. In an average month he'd earn ~£300 or so. Though usually quite a lot more around Christmas.

CobrastanJorji 6y ago
For the radio, in the US, artists are not paid a cent. Only the songwriters and publishers are paid.
- rewgs 6y ago
  True, but an indie artist is nearly always the songwriter and publisher (no one else owns the publishing rights, hence “independent”). So it’s a fair comparison, and unfortunately, all else being equal, streaming woefully underperforms to radio to the point of tears.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - zdragnar 6y ago
    Maybe it is different in other areas of the country, but even in the nearby metro area, there are at most two or three "indie" stations (that is being generous, since I can only think of one) not counting the university stations that have virtually zero physical reach. Streaming might not pay much, but at least it is possible to be heard at all I suppose.
    - rewgs 6y ago
      What do you mean by the term “indie” here? Are the stations themselves not affiliated with larger corporations? Or are they mainly playing independent artists? Or both? I’m a professional musician and categorically reject the “but at least it is possible to be heard at all” angle. No. That is bullshit. Spotify is replacing BOTH album sales and radio play, and yet it pays multiple orders of magnitude worse than either.

TheSoftwareGuy 6y ago

I’ve noticed this too. The title has an air of “this is how you can pull yourself up by the bootstraps” feeling that turns into a “just takeover your dads company” when you read the article

JavaOffScript 6y ago

> I've been on editorial playlists 16 times but I have no idea how to replicate that. I do. Track down whoever at spotify controls those playlists and offer them money. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payola https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payola