4 ms·

Simple solution: let ranchers shoot problematic species.

Icathian 6y ago
It's been suggested a lot. It might even work. It boils down to whether you believe rancher's incentives are ever going to reconcile with responsibly pruning dangerous species. Historically that hasn't worked out well.
logicchains 6y ago
That's what Australia does for feral pigs, and it works pretty well.
- DuskStar 6y ago
  Right, but the ideal number of feral hogs is zero. The ideal number of wild wolves is not zero.
  - captainredbeard 6y ago
    That isn’t a universally accepted opinion.
    - DuskStar 6y ago
      Feral hogs are an invasive species in the US that causes significant property and ecological damage while also not being a particularly good game animal. That ticks pretty much all the "we don't want this here" boxes that I'm aware of. Who wants feral hogs?
centimeter 6y ago
Depending on the state, and depending on how problematic the individual animal is, you can. In many states you can shoot hogs whenever you want. Remember that whole thing where a bunch of twitter people who’d never been on a farm made fun of that politician for saying he had to shoot like 50 feral hogs at once? That’s a real thing - more than once I’ve been on an acquaintance’s ranch, standing up in the back of a truck or Polaris with an AR-15 chasing down dozens and dozens of hogs. They breed quickly and are very destructive! Texas tried to poison them and it didn’t work well enough. Usually with other species like bears or wolves, you are only supposed to shoot them if they actually attack livestock (and sometimes not even then).
- dreamcompiler 6y ago
  Family member in Texas goes hog hunting every year and always has sausage in the freezer. There are millions of them. Your story about the Polaris and AR-15 is spot on; this is possibly the only game animal for which an AR-15 is the perfect rifle.
  - snypher 6y ago
    Their story may be accurate but they misrepresented the politicians story, re seeking out vs being invaded by a wild pack.
    - dreamcompiler 6y ago
      They are definitely an invasive species, although the damage they do is mostly ecological and economic; they're not really dangerous to people directly. I've heard stories to that effect but I expect they're exaggerated.
earthscienceman 6y ago
In Colorado you can shoot anything you want if it is harassing your cattle, even family dogs. An example from my hometown: https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news/da-will-not-press-charges-after-kremmling-rancher-shoots-kills-neighbors-husky-puppy/ https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news/da-will-not-press-charge...
- woeirua 6y ago
  Seems like an overreaction but some dogs behave very aggressively around cattle and other animals due to instinct. Its entirely possible that the dog was not responsive to commands, and was going after the cattle in a serious way. A 4 month old husky is not a tiny puppy. There's more to this story than meets the eye. I highly doubt the neighbor shot the dog without trying anything else first.
  - hombre_fatal 6y ago
    Where my parents live in the countryside, some people -- like kids visiting their parents for the month -- will bring their dogs and let them roam around. Dogs will form up in a pack of 2 or more and kill things on your property, like chickens. Or they'll instigate larger animals like the emus and end up biting/breaking the animal's ankle. You can scare them away easily (dogs are generally skittish) but they'll come back. I've also learned that some people are completely unreasonable when it comes to their pets, basically believing that "it's just a dog" and you're the asshole if you can't handle it being on your property.
dr-detroit 6y ago
Most of this country is owned by land baron families with multiple hundred thousands of acres
ivanhoe 6y ago
Thing is that those species like coyotes or raccoons or deers are problematic simply because their populations have grown too big. You want to put their populations under the control, but not exterminate them completely. And that second part is where ranchers are not very good at, and then you end up having to install external controls to regulate the hunting and the whole thing becomes a lot more complicated and expensive for tax payers.
pvaldes 6y ago
This idea is anti-economic. It has always ended in a very expensive mess by the unavoidable and huge collateral damages each time it was implemented

It's been suggested a lot. It might even work. It boils down to whether you believe rancher's incentives are ever going to reconcile with responsibly pruning dangerous species. Historically that hasn't worked out well.

logicchains 6y ago

That's what Australia does for feral pigs, and it works pretty well.

DuskStar 6y ago
Right, but the ideal number of feral hogs is zero. The ideal number of wild wolves is not zero.
- captainredbeard 6y ago
  That isn’t a universally accepted opinion.
  - DuskStar 6y ago
    Feral hogs are an invasive species in the US that causes significant property and ecological damage while also not being a particularly good game animal. That ticks pretty much all the "we don't want this here" boxes that I'm aware of. Who wants feral hogs?

centimeter 6y ago

Depending on the state, and depending on how problematic the individual animal is, you can. In many states you can shoot hogs whenever you want. Remember that whole thing where a bunch of twitter people who’d never been on a farm made fun of that politician for saying he had to shoot like 50 feral hogs at once? That’s a real thing - more than once I’ve been on an acquaintance’s ranch, standing up in the back of a truck or Polaris with an AR-15 chasing down dozens and dozens of hogs. They breed quickly and are very destructive! Texas tried to poison them and it didn’t work well enough. Usually with other species like bears or wolves, you are only supposed to shoot them if they actually attack livestock (and sometimes not even then).

dreamcompiler 6y ago
Family member in Texas goes hog hunting every year and always has sausage in the freezer. There are millions of them. Your story about the Polaris and AR-15 is spot on; this is possibly the only game animal for which an AR-15 is the perfect rifle.
- snypher 6y ago
  Their story may be accurate but they misrepresented the politicians story, re seeking out vs being invaded by a wild pack.
  - dreamcompiler 6y ago
    They are definitely an invasive species, although the damage they do is mostly ecological and economic; they're not really dangerous to people directly. I've heard stories to that effect but I expect they're exaggerated.

earthscienceman 6y ago

In Colorado you can shoot anything you want if it is harassing your cattle, even family dogs. An example from my hometown: https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news/da-will-not-press-charges-after-kremmling-rancher-shoots-kills-neighbors-husky-puppy/ https://www.steamboatpilot.com/news/da-will-not-press-charge...

woeirua 6y ago
Seems like an overreaction but some dogs behave very aggressively around cattle and other animals due to instinct. Its entirely possible that the dog was not responsive to commands, and was going after the cattle in a serious way. A 4 month old husky is not a tiny puppy. There's more to this story than meets the eye. I highly doubt the neighbor shot the dog without trying anything else first.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  Where my parents live in the countryside, some people -- like kids visiting their parents for the month -- will bring their dogs and let them roam around. Dogs will form up in a pack of 2 or more and kill things on your property, like chickens. Or they'll instigate larger animals like the emus and end up biting/breaking the animal's ankle. You can scare them away easily (dogs are generally skittish) but they'll come back. I've also learned that some people are completely unreasonable when it comes to their pets, basically believing that "it's just a dog" and you're the asshole if you can't handle it being on your property.

dr-detroit 6y ago

Most of this country is owned by land baron families with multiple hundred thousands of acres

ivanhoe 6y ago

Thing is that those species like coyotes or raccoons or deers are problematic simply because their populations have grown too big. You want to put their populations under the control, but not exterminate them completely. And that second part is where ranchers are not very good at, and then you end up having to install external controls to regulate the hunting and the whole thing becomes a lot more complicated and expensive for tax payers.

pvaldes 6y ago

This idea is anti-economic. It has always ended in a very expensive mess by the unavoidable and huge collateral damages each time it was implemented