10 ms·

Older article, but apparently Pakistan carts its nuclear weapons around in regular delivery vans: https://www.wired.com/2011/11/pakistan-nukes-delivery-vans/ ht

Older article, but apparently Pakistan carts its nuclear weapons around in regular delivery vans: https://www.wired.com/2011/11/pakistan-nukes-delivery-vans/ https://www.wired.com/2011/11/pakistan-nukes-delivery-vans/ I personally think this is a bad idea.

mauvehaus 6y ago
The Brits moved the plutonium or HEU (don’t remember which) for their first bomb around in quite ordinary lorries: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk_zpjK3cTo https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk_zpjK3cTo I’m not saying it’s a good idea, but there’s certainly precedent.
- floren 6y ago
  The plutonium pit for the Trinity test was carried from Los Alamos to the test site in a 1942 Plymouth Special Deluxe: http://nuclearsciencemuseum.blogspot.com/2008/08/first-planes-no-trains-now-automobiles.html http://nuclearsciencemuseum.blogspot.com/2008/08/first-plane...
- catalogia 6y ago
  The British still use trucks to transport their nuclear weapons. Search online for "TCHD Convoy" for some pictures. America also continues to use trucks, in some contexts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_Nuclear_Material_Transport_Operations#Nuclear_weapon_transport_by_road https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_Nuclear_Material_Trans...
ceejayoz 6y ago
There may be substantial non-visible security assets nearby. The USSS has minigun-equipped SUVs, for example; you wouldn't necessarily know they're there until the six barrel gun pops out of the sunroof and opens fire. There's something to be said for subtlety. The US President travels around in a giant motorcade; the UK PM travels in an unmarked Jag with a couple motorcycle escorts.
- antisthenes 6y ago
  > The USSS has minigun-equipped SUVs, for example; you wouldn't necessarily know they're there until the six barrel gun pops out of the sunroof and opens fire. So that scene with Nick Fury in Winter Soldier isn't far removed from reality?
  - ceejayoz 6y ago
    Correct. There's very 90s video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIu4wVBfT30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIu4wVBfT30
    - aspenmayer 6y ago
      Not sure if you intended to link to some QAnon propaganda account, but there are other sources of that same info. Here's a video showing the vehicle in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j0eJ0xB7LU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j0eJ0xB7LU Vendor's product page: https://dillonaero.com/product/convoy-escort-vehicle-cev-2/ https://dillonaero.com/product/convoy-escort-vehicle-cev-2/
      - ceejayoz 6y ago
        Sorry about that, just the first one to come up in my search. I just watched a few seconds to confirm it was the vehicle I was thinking of. (Too old to edit/delete. Argh.)
        widforss 6y ago
        Maybe dang can help you remove it.
        aspenmayer 6y ago
        I apologize. I should not have assumed it was associated with the other Q. I feel like I'm part of the problem for assuming it was. I didn't do my homework, and I accordingly deserve to admit my mistake. Please, don't be sorry. You didn't mean anything wrong, and I was actually wrong.
kilroy123 6y ago
This can not be true. I don't want to believe.
edm0nd 6y ago
I mean their own Pakistani government is known for harboring terrorists and it is also where Bin Laden was found. It's not the best of countries.
- pknerd 6y ago
  Osama was CIA friend in past. Kindly don't stirr useless debate.
  - edm0nd 6y ago
    lol, don't let your own bias or own Pakistani government cloud your vision with lies ;) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_and_state-sponsored_terrorism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_and_state-sponsored_t... - https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/01/05/why-pakistan-supports-terrorist-groups-and-why-the-us-finds-it-so-hard-to-induce-change/ https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/01/05/w... - https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/double-game-why-pakistan-supports-militants-resists-us-pressure-stop https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/double-gam...
newyankee 6y ago
Didn't want to add politics to this, but i hope they get more funding for safety. Sadly, most of the funding they get from US and other Western countries is gobbled up by the Army which is the most powerful institution in the country. Their economic situation is a little worse now and it is likely they will become a vassal state of China in the future as well. China will take the role of USA in the country if it goes the other way.
- nickik 6y ago
  So you want to give them more money even if you know that money is systematically misused? Pakistan will become a vessel state of China, its totally inevitable. Pakistan is 1000x more valuable to China then it could ever by for the US. The US should stop the idiotic believe that Pakistan is an ally. They simply are not, and have not been for a long time. It is well known that the support the Taliban. It is well known they are one of the main pushers of radical Islam. The only real value they ever had was to help against the Soviets when they invaded Afghanistan. And to do that the US ignored the warnings that they were developing nuclear weapons and basically created anti-western radical Islam.
  - newyankee 6y ago
    The problem is that the general public is very fond of conspiracy theory for every problem under the sun. Every issue will be attributed to malicious intent of India, USA or Israel (somehow that comes into the mix). If the general public does not evolve, how would the army or govt.
  - catalogia 6y ago
    > The US should stop the idiotic believe that Pakistan is an ally. Do they actually believe it, or do they just pay lip service to that idea for realpolitik reasons? The US has repeatedly accused China of assisting Pakistan with their nuclear weapons program. It's hard for any of us to say what the truth is in that matter, but either way I don't think the potential relationship between Pakistan and China has been ignored.
    - 6y ago
ta17711771 6y ago
How do you think toxic waste is carried over the US/Canadian border? Hint: it's trucks and trailers.
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  There's a significant difference between toxic waste and fully functional nuclear warheads, though.
detaro 6y ago
US nuke transports don't look that impressive either: https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-nuclear-couriers-20170310-story.html https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-nuclear-couriers-201703... (of course it is entirely possible that Pakistan doesn't have much in the way of hidden security around those, but flying under the radar seems to be a common theme for this business)
- RandomBacon 6y ago
  "The axles are designed to explode to prevent a trailer from being towed away." Smart. Reminds me of how in movies or TV shows if the person being kidnapped would just go limp instead of following the kidnapper, 99% of the problem could be solved right there. Don't aid the enemy.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
walrus01 6y ago
It's not a completely illogical approach. An armored convoy stands out like a sore thumb in Rawalpindi. An ordinary slightly beat up, 6-8 year old Suzuki Bolan does not. Maybe send out a few decoy high security vehicles with uniformed crews going in a few different directions, and then send out the Bolan going elsewhere. Bolan: https://www.google.com/search?q=suzuki+bolan&client=ubuntu&hs=KEu&channel=fs&sxsrf=ALeKk02P_bWoqZRjBByUP7SnTCmnTSXJwA:1593107959045&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiT4fLPxZ3qAhXQv54KHa_XBrsQ_AUoAXoECEsQAw&biw=1524&bih=1451 https://www.google.com/search?q=suzuki+bolan&client=ubuntu&h...
- haram_masala 6y ago
  If an armored convoy is not enough to protect your nuclear weapons, then you have an entirely different problem that needs solving first.
  - Balgair 6y ago
    The history of Pakistan in a nutshell
  - abdullahkhalids 6y ago
    I think its an intelligence thing, protecting nuclear weapon movement from foreign satellites/drones etc.
  - colinmhayes 6y ago
    Might be true, but that won't stop Pakistan from developing nuclear weapons.
    - sudosysgen 6y ago
      They've already had them for a few decades.
  - ceejayoz 6y ago
    > If an armored convoy is not enough to protect your nuclear weapons... The concern appears to be, at least partially, "the Americans will watch the convoys via satellite and know where we've got them all stored".
andbberger 6y ago
This might not be as bad as it seems. At least in the US, the inherent security of nuclear weapons is kind of incredible. I can't be bothered to find a reference, but it's expected that an agency with nation-state level resources in possession of a weapon _and_ its blueprints still would not be able to detonate it. The term to google here is permissive action link

mauvehaus 6y ago

The Brits moved the plutonium or HEU (don’t remember which) for their first bomb around in quite ordinary lorries: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk_zpjK3cTo https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk_zpjK3cTo I’m not saying it’s a good idea, but there’s certainly precedent.

floren 6y ago
The plutonium pit for the Trinity test was carried from Los Alamos to the test site in a 1942 Plymouth Special Deluxe: http://nuclearsciencemuseum.blogspot.com/2008/08/first-planes-no-trains-now-automobiles.html http://nuclearsciencemuseum.blogspot.com/2008/08/first-plane...
catalogia 6y ago
The British still use trucks to transport their nuclear weapons. Search online for "TCHD Convoy" for some pictures. America also continues to use trucks, in some contexts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_Nuclear_Material_Transport_Operations#Nuclear_weapon_transport_by_road https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_Nuclear_Material_Trans...

ceejayoz 6y ago

There may be substantial non-visible security assets nearby. The USSS has minigun-equipped SUVs, for example; you wouldn't necessarily know they're there until the six barrel gun pops out of the sunroof and opens fire. There's something to be said for subtlety. The US President travels around in a giant motorcade; the UK PM travels in an unmarked Jag with a couple motorcycle escorts.

antisthenes 6y ago
> The USSS has minigun-equipped SUVs, for example; you wouldn't necessarily know they're there until the six barrel gun pops out of the sunroof and opens fire. So that scene with Nick Fury in Winter Soldier isn't far removed from reality?
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  Correct. There's very 90s video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIu4wVBfT30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIu4wVBfT30
  - aspenmayer 6y ago
    Not sure if you intended to link to some QAnon propaganda account, but there are other sources of that same info. Here's a video showing the vehicle in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j0eJ0xB7LU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j0eJ0xB7LU Vendor's product page: https://dillonaero.com/product/convoy-escort-vehicle-cev-2/ https://dillonaero.com/product/convoy-escort-vehicle-cev-2/
    - ceejayoz 6y ago
      Sorry about that, just the first one to come up in my search. I just watched a few seconds to confirm it was the vehicle I was thinking of. (Too old to edit/delete. Argh.)
      - widforss 6y ago
        Maybe dang can help you remove it.
      - aspenmayer 6y ago
        I apologize. I should not have assumed it was associated with the other Q. I feel like I'm part of the problem for assuming it was. I didn't do my homework, and I accordingly deserve to admit my mistake. Please, don't be sorry. You didn't mean anything wrong, and I was actually wrong.

kilroy123 6y ago

This can not be true. I don't want to believe.

edm0nd 6y ago

I mean their own Pakistani government is known for harboring terrorists and it is also where Bin Laden was found. It's not the best of countries.

pknerd 6y ago
Osama was CIA friend in past. Kindly don't stirr useless debate.
- edm0nd 6y ago
  lol, don't let your own bias or own Pakistani government cloud your vision with lies ;) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_and_state-sponsored_terrorism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_and_state-sponsored_t... - https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/01/05/why-pakistan-supports-terrorist-groups-and-why-the-us-finds-it-so-hard-to-induce-change/ https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2018/01/05/w... - https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/double-game-why-pakistan-supports-militants-resists-us-pressure-stop https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/double-gam...

newyankee 6y ago

Didn't want to add politics to this, but i hope they get more funding for safety. Sadly, most of the funding they get from US and other Western countries is gobbled up by the Army which is the most powerful institution in the country. Their economic situation is a little worse now and it is likely they will become a vassal state of China in the future as well. China will take the role of USA in the country if it goes the other way.

nickik 6y ago
So you want to give them more money even if you know that money is systematically misused? Pakistan will become a vessel state of China, its totally inevitable. Pakistan is 1000x more valuable to China then it could ever by for the US. The US should stop the idiotic believe that Pakistan is an ally. They simply are not, and have not been for a long time. It is well known that the support the Taliban. It is well known they are one of the main pushers of radical Islam. The only real value they ever had was to help against the Soviets when they invaded Afghanistan. And to do that the US ignored the warnings that they were developing nuclear weapons and basically created anti-western radical Islam.
- newyankee 6y ago
  The problem is that the general public is very fond of conspiracy theory for every problem under the sun. Every issue will be attributed to malicious intent of India, USA or Israel (somehow that comes into the mix). If the general public does not evolve, how would the army or govt.
- catalogia 6y ago
  > The US should stop the idiotic believe that Pakistan is an ally. Do they actually believe it, or do they just pay lip service to that idea for realpolitik reasons? The US has repeatedly accused China of assisting Pakistan with their nuclear weapons program. It's hard for any of us to say what the truth is in that matter, but either way I don't think the potential relationship between Pakistan and China has been ignored.
  - 6y ago

ta17711771 6y ago

How do you think toxic waste is carried over the US/Canadian border? Hint: it's trucks and trailers.

ceejayoz 6y ago
There's a significant difference between toxic waste and fully functional nuclear warheads, though.

detaro 6y ago

US nuke transports don't look that impressive either: https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-nuclear-couriers-20170310-story.html https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-nuclear-couriers-201703... (of course it is entirely possible that Pakistan doesn't have much in the way of hidden security around those, but flying under the radar seems to be a common theme for this business)

RandomBacon 6y ago
"The axles are designed to explode to prevent a trailer from being towed away." Smart. Reminds me of how in movies or TV shows if the person being kidnapped would just go limp instead of following the kidnapper, 99% of the problem could be solved right there. Don't aid the enemy.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

walrus01 6y ago

It's not a completely illogical approach. An armored convoy stands out like a sore thumb in Rawalpindi. An ordinary slightly beat up, 6-8 year old Suzuki Bolan does not. Maybe send out a few decoy high security vehicles with uniformed crews going in a few different directions, and then send out the Bolan going elsewhere. Bolan: https://www.google.com/search?q=suzuki+bolan&client=ubuntu&hs=KEu&channel=fs&sxsrf=ALeKk02P_bWoqZRjBByUP7SnTCmnTSXJwA:1593107959045&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiT4fLPxZ3qAhXQv54KHa_XBrsQ_AUoAXoECEsQAw&biw=1524&bih=1451 https://www.google.com/search?q=suzuki+bolan&client=ubuntu&h...

haram_masala 6y ago
If an armored convoy is not enough to protect your nuclear weapons, then you have an entirely different problem that needs solving first.
- Balgair 6y ago
  The history of Pakistan in a nutshell
- abdullahkhalids 6y ago
  I think its an intelligence thing, protecting nuclear weapon movement from foreign satellites/drones etc.
- colinmhayes 6y ago
  Might be true, but that won't stop Pakistan from developing nuclear weapons.
  - sudosysgen 6y ago
    They've already had them for a few decades.
- ceejayoz 6y ago
  > If an armored convoy is not enough to protect your nuclear weapons... The concern appears to be, at least partially, "the Americans will watch the convoys via satellite and know where we've got them all stored".

andbberger 6y ago

This might not be as bad as it seems. At least in the US, the inherent security of nuclear weapons is kind of incredible. I can't be bothered to find a reference, but it's expected that an agency with nation-state level resources in possession of a weapon _and_ its blueprints still would not be able to detonate it. The term to google here is permissive action link