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I wish they would give a clear picture on virtualization performance if they’re not going to support dual booting. If Linux and Windows virtualization are not a

I wish they would give a clear picture on virtualization performance if they’re not going to support dual booting. If Linux and Windows virtualization are not at least on par with their 2019/20 models, these things are dead in the water for me as dev machines.

ghaff 6y ago
There's no reason to believe that Windows will run in a VM on a Mac with Apple silicon anyway. I don't believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that Apple has said anything about Rosetta 2 emulation applying to an entire VM. I have to believe that would be dog slow in any case. And lacking that, standard x86 Windows isn't going to run. And even if there were a version of Windows which worked--by no means a given even if there's an Arm version for the Surface--none of the standard Windows apps would run. So I'm not sure what use running Windows on a Mac is doing to be to anyone in that case.
- makomk 6y ago
  As I understand it, Apple have specifically said that Rosetta 2 emulation will not support VMs at all.
  - sigjuice 6y ago
    https://developer.apple.com/documentation/apple_silicon/about_the_rosetta_translation_environment https://developer.apple.com/documentation/apple_silicon/abou... There are a few things in the section "What Can't Be Translated?", including Virtual Machine apps that virtualize x86_64 computer platforms
    - Gaelan 6y ago
      I understand that VirtualBox has a "software emulation" mode (on x86 host and guest) where it doesn't use any hardware virtualization features, and instead runs the guest OS with some sort of JIT that rewrites any hardware access to VM calls. Maybe that would work in Rosetta?
- dchest 6y ago
  In the same interview, Craig said they run virtualized ARM Linux. It’s virtualization, not emulation, so x86 won’t run indeed.
  - ghaff 6y ago
    Thank you for confirming. That was my assumption. There's certainly no lack of Arm Linux versions. In fact, the new supercomputer at the top of the TOP500 list uses Arm chips and runs a supported Linux (RHEL).

ghaff 6y ago

There's no reason to believe that Windows will run in a VM on a Mac with Apple silicon anyway. I don't believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that Apple has said anything about Rosetta 2 emulation applying to an entire VM. I have to believe that would be dog slow in any case. And lacking that, standard x86 Windows isn't going to run. And even if there were a version of Windows which worked--by no means a given even if there's an Arm version for the Surface--none of the standard Windows apps would run. So I'm not sure what use running Windows on a Mac is doing to be to anyone in that case.

makomk 6y ago
As I understand it, Apple have specifically said that Rosetta 2 emulation will not support VMs at all.
- sigjuice 6y ago
  https://developer.apple.com/documentation/apple_silicon/about_the_rosetta_translation_environment https://developer.apple.com/documentation/apple_silicon/abou... There are a few things in the section "What Can't Be Translated?", including Virtual Machine apps that virtualize x86_64 computer platforms
  - Gaelan 6y ago
    I understand that VirtualBox has a "software emulation" mode (on x86 host and guest) where it doesn't use any hardware virtualization features, and instead runs the guest OS with some sort of JIT that rewrites any hardware access to VM calls. Maybe that would work in Rosetta?
dchest 6y ago
In the same interview, Craig said they run virtualized ARM Linux. It’s virtualization, not emulation, so x86 won’t run indeed.
- ghaff 6y ago
  Thank you for confirming. That was my assumption. There's certainly no lack of Arm Linux versions. In fact, the new supercomputer at the top of the TOP500 list uses Arm chips and runs a supported Linux (RHEL).