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The lockdown is causing deaths too which also need to be considered. We shut down cancer screening and gyms for 3 months in Ontario; that’s almost certainly go

by aianus 6y ago

The lockdown is causing deaths too which also need to be considered. We shut down cancer screening and gyms for 3 months in Ontario; that’s almost certainly going to kill more people than COVID did.

wonderwonder 6y ago
How will shutting down gyms for 3 months kill more people that covid? ~2600 people died from covid in Ontario. Are you saying that they gyms being closed caused more than that?
- aianus 6y ago
  At ~10y of life lost per COVID death that's about 320,000 months of life lost to COVID in Ontario. If there are ~1 million gym patrons in Ontario, then the gym lockdown (which is still ongoing) only needs to decrease a gym patron's lifespan by 10 days on average to be worse than COVID. Also, I claimed cancer screenings + gyms combined. Hundreds of people get diagnosed with malignant tumors every day in Ontario and those tumors are now 3 months more advanced than they should be (and will be for a long time after the lockdown until the queues for medical care clear up).
  - wonderwonder 6y ago
    That's just silly. You would get into the most ridiculous moral quandaries with thinking like that. If 75,000 people commute 1 hour each day on a highway and then someone offers to reconfigure the highway to cut the time in half and all he is asking for is the lives of 100 children, its a good trade! At an avg lifespan of 78 years, 100 kids is ~68 million hours. 30 minutes saved a day / 261 days / year for 75,000 people is ~9.7 million hours a year, so after 7 years, it basically free. Except we would never do that because we don't measure human value in hours because the people in power would be free to make some really terrible optimizations. You are right though, you did include cancers and I ignored it so we can call it a tie.
- pbreit 6y ago
  "and cancer screening"
tunesmith 6y ago
Please show your calculations of excess cancer deaths being greater than the projected non-lockdown Covid deaths over the same time period?
kaitai 6y ago
That's why the Paleolithic had shorter lifespans than moderns... no gyms....
- aianus 6y ago
  Heart disease and cancer kill more people per day than COVID even now. Edit: and it's not just the gym obviously, we've removed any incidental exercise one might get from work or leisure activities that were locked down too

by aianus 6y ago

wonderwonder 6y ago

How will shutting down gyms for 3 months kill more people that covid? ~2600 people died from covid in Ontario. Are you saying that they gyms being closed caused more than that?

aianus 6y ago
At ~10y of life lost per COVID death that's about 320,000 months of life lost to COVID in Ontario. If there are ~1 million gym patrons in Ontario, then the gym lockdown (which is still ongoing) only needs to decrease a gym patron's lifespan by 10 days on average to be worse than COVID. Also, I claimed cancer screenings + gyms combined. Hundreds of people get diagnosed with malignant tumors every day in Ontario and those tumors are now 3 months more advanced than they should be (and will be for a long time after the lockdown until the queues for medical care clear up).
- wonderwonder 6y ago
  That's just silly. You would get into the most ridiculous moral quandaries with thinking like that. If 75,000 people commute 1 hour each day on a highway and then someone offers to reconfigure the highway to cut the time in half and all he is asking for is the lives of 100 children, its a good trade! At an avg lifespan of 78 years, 100 kids is ~68 million hours. 30 minutes saved a day / 261 days / year for 75,000 people is ~9.7 million hours a year, so after 7 years, it basically free. Except we would never do that because we don't measure human value in hours because the people in power would be free to make some really terrible optimizations. You are right though, you did include cancers and I ignored it so we can call it a tie.
pbreit 6y ago
"and cancer screening"

tunesmith 6y ago

Please show your calculations of excess cancer deaths being greater than the projected non-lockdown Covid deaths over the same time period?

kaitai 6y ago

That's why the Paleolithic had shorter lifespans than moderns... no gyms....

aianus 6y ago
Heart disease and cancer kill more people per day than COVID even now. Edit: and it's not just the gym obviously, we've removed any incidental exercise one might get from work or leisure activities that were locked down too