7 ms·

Your Career in Computer Programming (2015)

70 points by benbreen 6y ago

troughway 6y ago
>Given a complex customer problem, a female analyst/programmer will often handle the problem better than would her male colleagues with equivalent experience and ability. Not because businessmen are more lenient or show favoritism toward the female of the species, but because the female is often more sensitive to the nuances of a problem and to the complex interpersonal relations that may be part of the problem. In a very real sense, every computer problem with a customer is also a customer relations problem, and this is where feminine tact, insight, and intuition, combining with solid programming and analytical ability, can really pay off for the girl programmer. The book is "brilliant" because of quips like the aforementioned. Now, lets flip the genders and see who gets to keep their head.
- dang 6y ago
  Please don't take the flamiest baitiest thing and start the discussion rolling downhill like this. It's exactly the opposite of what we're hoping for. Rather, you should comment on the most interesting thing. If there isn't anything interesting, or you don't have anything to say about it, please don't post. The idea is curious conversation. This is particularly important when a thread is new, because threads are sensitive to initial conditions. You wouldn't spill oil in a lake or toss litter in a park, so please don't do that here either. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - troughway 6y ago
    I disagree dang. It's literally half the article, and the author is practically gushing about it, in a time when as you yourself admit that bringing it up is the "flamiest baitiest thing". They could have chosen any other excerpt from the book. They chose this one. Flag the article - don't flag my commentary.
- LyndsySimon 6y ago
  Considering the book was written in 1967, that is a strikingly insightful observation. Taken in modern terms - “soft skills” (which were valued and expected in women, and not valued if not actively discouraged in men) are often at least as important as raw programming ability.
yowlingcat 6y ago
I'm sure someone here has a better explanation for a connection I've been thinking about (and saw on twitter, for what it's worth), so I figured I'd ask here. I've never looked that much into knitting, but the instructions seem remarkably similar to assembly language instructions. Beyond that, I did a little bit of research into a jacquard loom works the other day, and realized it operated using punch cards. This really fascinates me, because it seems to precede Babbage's machine and yet I never have read particularly much treatment of it in history of computing type treatises. I wonder if, given some of the conventionally more feminine stereotyped gender roles pertaining to knitting and clothmaking, any of this played into what early conceptions of what a "programmer" was? Was there a point where people reasonably made the inference that the closest analog for what early punch card programming was would be jacquard loom operation and knitting? It is fascinating how it the idea of the vocation of writing software flipped the other way in terms of gender stereotypes.
- thirdhaf 6y ago
  There's an episode of James Burke's Connections that explores this idea with a bit of depth, I recommend watching the whole series if you have the time. James Burke Connections, Ep. 4 "Faith in Numbers"
  - aspenmayer 6y ago
    I can second this recommendation, and broaden it to everything James Burke has ever done for BBC. He is an amazing science scholar, and also quite witty. He makes amazing educational programming. I especially enjoy Connections[1] and its sequel series, as well as the lesser-known The Day the Universe Changed[2] series, about the impact of science and technology on society, from a philosophical point-of-view, rather than the mainly technical approach of Connections. If anyone close to him is reading this, please thank him for me. I saw Connections many years ago, and he opened my eyes to the wonder of inventions. Anyone can make things. That’s how we got to today, just lots of interworking inventions. He changed my life. An excerpt from his Wikipedia page[3] I think HN readers may find intriguing: > Burke conceived a mobile app called Connections that would search Wikipedia and generate associations and connections among apparently unrelated fields of knowledge or topics. Surprises, anomalies, and unexpected perspectives on a search could emerge from using the app. According to Burke, the Connections app would be an innovative alternative to more linear internet search engines such as Google.[12] As of January 2017 the project had met only 1/3 of its Kickstarter crowdfunding goal.[13] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(TV_series) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(TV_series) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_the_Universe_Changed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_the_Universe_Changed [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Burke_(science_historian) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Burke_(science_historian... [Original Wikipedia links, numbered as quoted] [12] http://boingboing.net/2016/11/17/james-burkes-new-project-ai.html http://boingboing.net/2016/11/17/james-burkes-new-project-ai... [13] https://www.backerkit.com/projects/504632459/james-burke-connections-app https://www.backerkit.com/projects/504632459/james-burke-con...
RickJWagner 6y ago
What's interesting is that she didn't go to college-- she got offers from companies that had training programs. I started programming professionally in 1990. This is how many of the older colleagues I started with got their starts.
- noir_lord 6y ago
  Not that old but I started in the late 90s without a degree. Hasn't hurt my career so far, the people my level are a mix of degree/no degree. Had to go back and fill in the theory I missed over time as I've needed it occasionally. I still hold that programming for the real world should be taught as an apprenticeship, throwing people from CS into a software developer role is just unfair.
  - MaxBarraclough 6y ago
    > programming for the real world should be taught as an apprenticeship, throwing people from CS into a software developer role is just unfair. Isn't this what junior software developer roles do?
    - noir_lord 6y ago
      Not in my experience, very little teaching seems to be the norm. They just get thrown in with little oversight and support (unless they land on my team then I do my best to protect them from that).

70 points by benbreen 6y ago

>Given a complex customer problem, a female analyst/programmer will often handle the problem better than would her male colleagues with equivalent experience and ability. Not because businessmen are more lenient or show favoritism toward the female of the species, but because the female is often more sensitive to the nuances of a problem and to the complex interpersonal relations that may be part of the problem. In a very real sense, every computer problem with a customer is also a customer relations problem, and this is where feminine tact, insight, and intuition, combining with solid programming and analytical ability, can really pay off for the girl programmer. The book is "brilliant" because of quips like the aforementioned. Now, lets flip the genders and see who gets to keep their head.

dang 6y ago
Please don't take the flamiest baitiest thing and start the discussion rolling downhill like this. It's exactly the opposite of what we're hoping for. Rather, you should comment on the most interesting thing. If there isn't anything interesting, or you don't have anything to say about it, please don't post. The idea is curious conversation. This is particularly important when a thread is new, because threads are sensitive to initial conditions. You wouldn't spill oil in a lake or toss litter in a park, so please don't do that here either. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- troughway 6y ago
  I disagree dang. It's literally half the article, and the author is practically gushing about it, in a time when as you yourself admit that bringing it up is the "flamiest baitiest thing". They could have chosen any other excerpt from the book. They chose this one. Flag the article - don't flag my commentary.
LyndsySimon 6y ago
Considering the book was written in 1967, that is a strikingly insightful observation. Taken in modern terms - “soft skills” (which were valued and expected in women, and not valued if not actively discouraged in men) are often at least as important as raw programming ability.

yowlingcat 6y ago

I'm sure someone here has a better explanation for a connection I've been thinking about (and saw on twitter, for what it's worth), so I figured I'd ask here. I've never looked that much into knitting, but the instructions seem remarkably similar to assembly language instructions. Beyond that, I did a little bit of research into a jacquard loom works the other day, and realized it operated using punch cards. This really fascinates me, because it seems to precede Babbage's machine and yet I never have read particularly much treatment of it in history of computing type treatises. I wonder if, given some of the conventionally more feminine stereotyped gender roles pertaining to knitting and clothmaking, any of this played into what early conceptions of what a "programmer" was? Was there a point where people reasonably made the inference that the closest analog for what early punch card programming was would be jacquard loom operation and knitting? It is fascinating how it the idea of the vocation of writing software flipped the other way in terms of gender stereotypes.

thirdhaf 6y ago
There's an episode of James Burke's Connections that explores this idea with a bit of depth, I recommend watching the whole series if you have the time. James Burke Connections, Ep. 4 "Faith in Numbers"
- aspenmayer 6y ago
  I can second this recommendation, and broaden it to everything James Burke has ever done for BBC. He is an amazing science scholar, and also quite witty. He makes amazing educational programming. I especially enjoy Connections[1] and its sequel series, as well as the lesser-known The Day the Universe Changed[2] series, about the impact of science and technology on society, from a philosophical point-of-view, rather than the mainly technical approach of Connections. If anyone close to him is reading this, please thank him for me. I saw Connections many years ago, and he opened my eyes to the wonder of inventions. Anyone can make things. That’s how we got to today, just lots of interworking inventions. He changed my life. An excerpt from his Wikipedia page[3] I think HN readers may find intriguing: > Burke conceived a mobile app called Connections that would search Wikipedia and generate associations and connections among apparently unrelated fields of knowledge or topics. Surprises, anomalies, and unexpected perspectives on a search could emerge from using the app. According to Burke, the Connections app would be an innovative alternative to more linear internet search engines such as Google.[12] As of January 2017 the project had met only 1/3 of its Kickstarter crowdfunding goal.[13] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(TV_series) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(TV_series) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_the_Universe_Changed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_the_Universe_Changed [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Burke_(science_historian) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Burke_(science_historian... [Original Wikipedia links, numbered as quoted] [12] http://boingboing.net/2016/11/17/james-burkes-new-project-ai.html http://boingboing.net/2016/11/17/james-burkes-new-project-ai... [13] https://www.backerkit.com/projects/504632459/james-burke-connections-app https://www.backerkit.com/projects/504632459/james-burke-con...

RickJWagner 6y ago

What's interesting is that she didn't go to college-- she got offers from companies that had training programs. I started programming professionally in 1990. This is how many of the older colleagues I started with got their starts.

noir_lord 6y ago
Not that old but I started in the late 90s without a degree. Hasn't hurt my career so far, the people my level are a mix of degree/no degree. Had to go back and fill in the theory I missed over time as I've needed it occasionally. I still hold that programming for the real world should be taught as an apprenticeship, throwing people from CS into a software developer role is just unfair.
- MaxBarraclough 6y ago
  > programming for the real world should be taught as an apprenticeship, throwing people from CS into a software developer role is just unfair. Isn't this what junior software developer roles do?
  - noir_lord 6y ago
    Not in my experience, very little teaching seems to be the norm. They just get thrown in with little oversight and support (unless they land on my team then I do my best to protect them from that).