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I do it for the privacy. Google auctions user data to third parties for micro dollars on their ad exchange. https://static.googleusercontent.com/media/www.goog

I do it for the privacy. Google auctions user data to third parties for micro dollars on their ad exchange. https://static.googleusercontent.com/media/www.google.com/en//adexchange/AdExchangeOverview.pdf https://static.googleusercontent.com/media/www.google.com/en... Apple has no such business.

saagarjha 6y ago
Being able to change your default apps has nothing to do with privacy and everything to do with platform control.
- DevKoala 6y ago
  I stick with Apple for the privacy. There are features on Android I wish to use, but I can’t bring myself to use an Android phone or putting the effort of cleaning it from all of Google’s trackers.
  - sudosysgen 6y ago
    You can just flash your phone with LineageOS. Takes about an hour, and you're done.
    - swagonomixxx 6y ago
      What about all the apps that need the "Google Play Services" libraries?
      - codethief 6y ago
        There's always MicroG and the MicroG-infused version of LineageOS: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/ https://lineage.microg.org/ https://lineage.microg.org/
        sendilkumarn 6y ago
        jc! but isn't microg also requires us to enable some level of Google Play Services?
        codethief 6y ago
        Well, MicroG is meant to be a drop-in replacement for closed-source Google libraries on your phone (i.e. Google Play Services / Google Services Framework) but obviously it will still have to connect to Google servers if needed (although you're able to control for what purposes). For instance, push notifications for apps often use Google's Firebase Cloud Messaging platform and MicroG allows the user to still receive those notifications in the absense of Google Play Services / Google Services Framework. I suggest you have a closer look at the MicroG website where this is explained, too: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/
        sendilkumarn 6y ago
        Cool :) I am using openGApps but I think it does not have this flexibility I will switch over to microg :)
      - sudosysgen 6y ago
        I personally use microG and disable all of the features that call home to Google, except for those anonymized by microG. Works flawlessly, except for some apps that don't work but are easily replaced.
    - freehunter 6y ago
      So instead of trusting the hardware or OS maker you’re trusting a random third party?
      - AnthonyMouse 6y ago
        It isn't a random third party, it's a specific third party with a better privacy record than the hardware or OS maker.
      - sudosysgen 6y ago
        You can build LineageOS yourself if you want. The procedure is on their website. Then you can also read the code to make sure nothing funny is going on.
  - shawnz 6y ago
    What do you do about all of Apple's trackers?
    - DevKoala 6y ago
      Apple doesn't surface the information they collect to third parties. If you are talking about in app advertising tracking, I reset my tracking advertiser ID pretty often too.
      - shawnz 6y ago
        And what information does Google surface to third parties besides the tracking ID (which can also be reset easily on Android)?
        DevKoala 6y ago
        In the Ad Exchange, Google surfaces the full url, geo, and all browser identifier information under the RTB protocol. When tracked through apps, Google is equally open. Apple tries its best to combat tracking, but most apps will still do their best to jump through the tracking contention measures. https://9to5mac.com/2019/02/07/app-screen-record-apps-removed/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/02/07/app-screen-record-apps-remove... I'd say, always be vigilant of the apps you install. I often check my http request logs to see my phone activity.
  - asjw 6y ago
    > I stick with Apple for the privacy. The problema Is if you stick with Apple hardware there is no OS alternative you're stuck with what the dictator (benevolent or not) decides
    - freehunter 6y ago
      That’s the point. Some people like that and are willing to pay extra for that.
diminish 6y ago
apple sells users to apps and gets 30% cut.
- DevKoala 6y ago
  Can you provide a link? Is this the cut they take for their App Store? If so, that isn't even in the same scale of selling your browsing history. For example, if I knew your cookie, and had access to the Google Ad Exchange, I could get your full browsing history as seen by Google trackers. The third parties know how to tie your cookie to your other information through identity graphs.
  - shawnz 6y ago
    And what if you had access to the iCloud servers, where Safari history is stored without end-to-end encryption (unlike Chrome sync which is encrypted end-to-end)?
    - DevKoala 6y ago
      I and any other third party can buy their way into the google Ad Exchange, but nobody can buy their way into iCloud's servers; for example, China had to ask Apple to create a segregated iCloud to support iOS in China. It is possible that the US government has some snooping contract with iCloud, but they are definitely not the party I am trying to protect myself from. I am trying to protect myself from businesses using my data to influence my politics, lifestyle and purchases. Look into the business of companies like Liveramp, to see the kind of data exchanges that Google helps proliferate.
      - shawnz 6y ago
        Do you have a source that third-parties are able to see that data in Ad Exchange?
        DevKoala 6y ago
        Read into the RTB protocol. With every Google pixel, all of the information obtained by the HTTP request + publisher appended data is passed to Google and auction to advertisers. https://www.iab.com/guidelines/real-time-bidding-rtb-project/ https://www.iab.com/guidelines/real-time-bidding-rtb-project... Full disclosure: I work for one of these third parties. Safari/Firefox are the hardest browsers to track. Google extended the deadline for killing cookies which probably netted us another year worth of easy revenue before we have to start start relying on first party tracking.
neya 6y ago
Apple does listen to your intimate conversations though. https://www.mirror.co.uk/tech/apples-siri-listens-users-intimate-22062073 https://www.mirror.co.uk/tech/apples-siri-listens-users-inti...
- pseudalopex 6y ago
  Only if you opt in.[1] [1] https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/08/improving-siris-privacy-protections/ https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/08/improving-siris-priva...
dimator 6y ago
This is what-aboutism at it's finest. Changing default apps has nothing to do with privacy. How did you connect the two other than "but what about..."? In fact, forget about Android, every OS pretty much ever has allowed for changing default apps. This is strictly about control, and this current move is strictly about throwing EU regulators a slight curve ball.
heydabop 6y ago
Google auctions the promise of showing ads to relevant users. Google would be eliminating themselves as a middle man service by selling the data they've curated.

saagarjha 6y ago

Being able to change your default apps has nothing to do with privacy and everything to do with platform control.

DevKoala 6y ago
I stick with Apple for the privacy. There are features on Android I wish to use, but I can’t bring myself to use an Android phone or putting the effort of cleaning it from all of Google’s trackers.
- sudosysgen 6y ago
  You can just flash your phone with LineageOS. Takes about an hour, and you're done.
  - swagonomixxx 6y ago
    What about all the apps that need the "Google Play Services" libraries?
    - codethief 6y ago
      There's always MicroG and the MicroG-infused version of LineageOS: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/ https://lineage.microg.org/ https://lineage.microg.org/
      - sendilkumarn 6y ago
        jc! but isn't microg also requires us to enable some level of Google Play Services?
        codethief 6y ago
        Well, MicroG is meant to be a drop-in replacement for closed-source Google libraries on your phone (i.e. Google Play Services / Google Services Framework) but obviously it will still have to connect to Google servers if needed (although you're able to control for what purposes). For instance, push notifications for apps often use Google's Firebase Cloud Messaging platform and MicroG allows the user to still receive those notifications in the absense of Google Play Services / Google Services Framework. I suggest you have a closer look at the MicroG website where this is explained, too: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/
        sendilkumarn 6y ago
        Cool :) I am using openGApps but I think it does not have this flexibility I will switch over to microg :)
    - sudosysgen 6y ago
      I personally use microG and disable all of the features that call home to Google, except for those anonymized by microG. Works flawlessly, except for some apps that don't work but are easily replaced.
  - freehunter 6y ago
    So instead of trusting the hardware or OS maker you’re trusting a random third party?
    - AnthonyMouse 6y ago
      It isn't a random third party, it's a specific third party with a better privacy record than the hardware or OS maker.
    - sudosysgen 6y ago
      You can build LineageOS yourself if you want. The procedure is on their website. Then you can also read the code to make sure nothing funny is going on.
- shawnz 6y ago
  What do you do about all of Apple's trackers?
  - DevKoala 6y ago
    Apple doesn't surface the information they collect to third parties. If you are talking about in app advertising tracking, I reset my tracking advertiser ID pretty often too.
    - shawnz 6y ago
      And what information does Google surface to third parties besides the tracking ID (which can also be reset easily on Android)?
      - DevKoala 6y ago
        In the Ad Exchange, Google surfaces the full url, geo, and all browser identifier information under the RTB protocol. When tracked through apps, Google is equally open. Apple tries its best to combat tracking, but most apps will still do their best to jump through the tracking contention measures. https://9to5mac.com/2019/02/07/app-screen-record-apps-removed/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/02/07/app-screen-record-apps-remove... I'd say, always be vigilant of the apps you install. I often check my http request logs to see my phone activity.
- asjw 6y ago
  > I stick with Apple for the privacy. The problema Is if you stick with Apple hardware there is no OS alternative you're stuck with what the dictator (benevolent or not) decides
  - freehunter 6y ago
    That’s the point. Some people like that and are willing to pay extra for that.

diminish 6y ago

apple sells users to apps and gets 30% cut.

DevKoala 6y ago
Can you provide a link? Is this the cut they take for their App Store? If so, that isn't even in the same scale of selling your browsing history. For example, if I knew your cookie, and had access to the Google Ad Exchange, I could get your full browsing history as seen by Google trackers. The third parties know how to tie your cookie to your other information through identity graphs.
- shawnz 6y ago
  And what if you had access to the iCloud servers, where Safari history is stored without end-to-end encryption (unlike Chrome sync which is encrypted end-to-end)?
  - DevKoala 6y ago
    I and any other third party can buy their way into the google Ad Exchange, but nobody can buy their way into iCloud's servers; for example, China had to ask Apple to create a segregated iCloud to support iOS in China. It is possible that the US government has some snooping contract with iCloud, but they are definitely not the party I am trying to protect myself from. I am trying to protect myself from businesses using my data to influence my politics, lifestyle and purchases. Look into the business of companies like Liveramp, to see the kind of data exchanges that Google helps proliferate.
    - shawnz 6y ago
      Do you have a source that third-parties are able to see that data in Ad Exchange?
      - DevKoala 6y ago
        Read into the RTB protocol. With every Google pixel, all of the information obtained by the HTTP request + publisher appended data is passed to Google and auction to advertisers. https://www.iab.com/guidelines/real-time-bidding-rtb-project/ https://www.iab.com/guidelines/real-time-bidding-rtb-project... Full disclosure: I work for one of these third parties. Safari/Firefox are the hardest browsers to track. Google extended the deadline for killing cookies which probably netted us another year worth of easy revenue before we have to start start relying on first party tracking.

neya 6y ago

Apple does listen to your intimate conversations though. https://www.mirror.co.uk/tech/apples-siri-listens-users-intimate-22062073 https://www.mirror.co.uk/tech/apples-siri-listens-users-inti...

pseudalopex 6y ago
Only if you opt in.[1] [1] https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/08/improving-siris-privacy-protections/ https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/08/improving-siris-priva...

dimator 6y ago

This is what-aboutism at it's finest. Changing default apps has nothing to do with privacy. How did you connect the two other than "but what about..."? In fact, forget about Android, every OS pretty much ever has allowed for changing default apps. This is strictly about control, and this current move is strictly about throwing EU regulators a slight curve ball.

heydabop 6y ago

Google auctions the promise of showing ads to relevant users. Google would be eliminating themselves as a middle man service by selling the data they've curated.