3 ms·

Might be competition type thing, MS not wanting to or because they simply didn't get it to work yet. Speculation is free.

dahfizz 6y ago
> or because they simply didn't get it to work yet Based on how poorly every other Windows on Arm experiment has gone, I'm guessing Apple is not willing to officially sanction bootcamp (yet).
- oneplane 6y ago
  Other possibility: bootcamp (native Windows booting) requires something like iBoot starting a CSM or UEFI stub (if the A-SoC doesn't use UEFI - which it might not) to then start the Windows Boot Manager. I don't actually know the current status of supported Windows firmware loaders, but the most recent information I had was that even on ARM you needed UEFI with Secure Boot. I am interested in Linux on those Mac ARM desktop machines, probably takes a lot of effort, I don't see Apple making the effort themselves. On the other hand: there is a super small chance that if the A-series SoCs are marketable you'd get no-OS ARM (micro) servers. That'd be pretty cool.
  - dahfizz 6y ago
    I don't think it's an issue like that. You can run windows without secure boot[1], and the windows boot loader can be chain loaded from whatever apple is using if they are not using a standard eufi firmware for whatever reason. At the very least, booting windows is a relatively low effort problem to solve compared to everything else that has to happen to move a whole ecosystem to a new architecture. We can conclude its a low priority for Apple, if it's something they still want to support at all. [1] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufacture/desktop/disabling-secure-boot#disable-secure-boot https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufactur...
    - oneplane 6y ago
      I don't think you can run Windows on ARM without UEFI and Secure Boot. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/bringup/uefi-requirements-that-apply-to-all-windows-platforms https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/br... Apple doesn't use UEFI on their ARM systems, so it'd be an extra effort indeed.
      - GeekyBear 6y ago
        Apple uses UEFI on it's Intel Macs. https://support.apple.com/guide/security/uefi-firmware-overview-seced055bcf6/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/uefi-firmware-overv... Why assume this would change?

dahfizz 6y ago

> or because they simply didn't get it to work yet Based on how poorly every other Windows on Arm experiment has gone, I'm guessing Apple is not willing to officially sanction bootcamp (yet).

oneplane 6y ago
Other possibility: bootcamp (native Windows booting) requires something like iBoot starting a CSM or UEFI stub (if the A-SoC doesn't use UEFI - which it might not) to then start the Windows Boot Manager. I don't actually know the current status of supported Windows firmware loaders, but the most recent information I had was that even on ARM you needed UEFI with Secure Boot. I am interested in Linux on those Mac ARM desktop machines, probably takes a lot of effort, I don't see Apple making the effort themselves. On the other hand: there is a super small chance that if the A-series SoCs are marketable you'd get no-OS ARM (micro) servers. That'd be pretty cool.
- dahfizz 6y ago
  I don't think it's an issue like that. You can run windows without secure boot[1], and the windows boot loader can be chain loaded from whatever apple is using if they are not using a standard eufi firmware for whatever reason. At the very least, booting windows is a relatively low effort problem to solve compared to everything else that has to happen to move a whole ecosystem to a new architecture. We can conclude its a low priority for Apple, if it's something they still want to support at all. [1] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufacture/desktop/disabling-secure-boot#disable-secure-boot https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufactur...
  - oneplane 6y ago
    I don't think you can run Windows on ARM without UEFI and Secure Boot. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/bringup/uefi-requirements-that-apply-to-all-windows-platforms https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/br... Apple doesn't use UEFI on their ARM systems, so it'd be an extra effort indeed.
    - GeekyBear 6y ago
      Apple uses UEFI on it's Intel Macs. https://support.apple.com/guide/security/uefi-firmware-overview-seced055bcf6/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/uefi-firmware-overv... Why assume this would change?